Draw Process Working Group Recommendations on Primary Draw Methods & Preference Points

[Winchester]

That is NOT what I said. You are cherry picking what you want from this conversation to fit your narrative/argument.

No need to cherry pick, that is EXACTLY what you meant.
Colorado V said Colorado should have a 72/25 split across the board. You believe that makes residents "greedy" (your word), which implies you think nonresidents should receive MORE than 25% (which is just wrong).

The rest of your discussion is completely twisted around.
Residents want at least 75/25 because they are OUR tags, which has nothing to do with point creep, so that doesn't belong in your discussion.
There are other proposals (which I discussed) that are designed to address point creep, but that's not what 75/25 is about.

 

[disabled combat vet]

I don't mind having type A tags leftover means more animals for the following year lol, just reduce the non resident tags and let the non residents spend more money here in Colorado visiting and skiing lol and that would make up the loss revenue for tags lol

 

[Hilltop]

I don't think there is a good answer that satisfies everyone. All sates should make sure residents have a way to hunt yearly. Residents have to be the priority but I do think that western states should be mindful of the message they send to non-residents while they take care of their residents. There are some pretty big anti-hunting forces out there ready to pounce and I believe it will take a concerted effort by all to fight them off in the coming years. States like Colorado are already at the tipping point politically so support outside of state lines will be crucial imo. Wyoming is further down the line but Cheyenne, Laramie, and Jackson are shifting from their historical conservative values. In another 10-20 years, Wyoming may be in the same position. Other western states are at various points in the "transition" but it is happening everywhere.

Bottom line is we need to find ways to be on common ground with these larger issues, regardless of where our home is located.

 

[Winchester]

Well said Hilltop

 

[Colorado Cowboy]

As usual, he is spot on!

 

[ColoradoV]

Few things from where I sit and first it is the perception that CPW loves nr money is dated or they don't.. The only reason Colo is not at the same resident/nr split of tags is the outfitting industry period.. Some see it as a govt supported subsidy while others see it as necessary for the public but the truth can't be denied. = That is the outfitting industry is why there is not what the entire west sees as an equitable split of opportunity for residents in Co. Colo is flush with cash = don't doubt that or Co can afford to sell every single license to a resident with no effect to wildlife or parks...

Sorry man but 75/25 spit of all (every single one w a hard cap) tags is very reasonable moving forward to all parties involved. So much so that NR should line up in lock step to support it = as it is not 90/10 like most of the big game states that touch Colorado.. The fact that it is not 75/25 over all choices = is again due to a "greedy" outfitting industry that I guess is supposed to be supporting Res hunting... Don't put that "hate" on resident hunters it is not fair man.. Residents in Co are actually more supportive of NR than ANY other western state and it would be nice for nr to not only recognize but also appreciate this fact and support a very fair 75/25 split of all tags.

Last thing I got is we ALL (Res/nr) need in this political environment resident voting hunters way more than Nr who show up one week a year and bitch bout Colorado the other 51 weeks the year. Something to think about is a hunter from Denver staying in meeker spends the same amount of money for everything (well except for a outfitter) as his nr peer.. The only people who can help to move the needle in Co are Co residents and a lot of new folks moving in want to hunt and need the opportunity to do so for everyones benefit.

 

[Winchester]

^^ sounds correct to me.

 

[RICMIC]

Unfortunately much of this discussion will become moot with the use of wildlife management via referendum to eliminate hunting.

 

[dan maule]

Unfortunately much of this discussion will become moot with the use of wildlife management via referendum to eliminate hunting.

That is exactly what the wolf reintroduction is about.

 

[ScottR]

Few things from where I sit and first it is the perception that CPW loves nr money is dated or they don't.. The only reason Colo is not at the same resident/nr split of tags is the outfitting industry period.. Some see it as a govt supported subsidy while others see it as necessary for the public but the truth can't be denied. = That is the outfitting industry is why there is not what the entire west sees as an equitable split of opportunity for residents in Co. Colo is flush with cash = don't doubt that or Co can afford to sell every single license to a resident with no effect to wildlife or parks...

Sorry man but 75/25 spit of all (every single one w a hard cap) tags is very reasonable moving forward to all parties involved. So much so that NR should line up in lock step to support it = as it is not 90/10 like most of the big game states that touch Colorado.. The fact that it is not 75/25 over all choices = is again due to a "greedy" outfitting industry that I guess is supposed to be supporting Res hunting... Don't put that "hate" on resident hunters it is not fair man.. Residents in Co are actually more supportive of NR than ANY other western state and it would be nice for nr to not only recognize but also appreciate this fact and support a very fair 75/25 split of all tags.

Last thing I got is we ALL (Res/nr) need in this political environment resident voting hunters way more than Nr who show up one week a year and bitch bout Colorado the other 51 weeks the year. Something to think about is a hunter from Denver staying in meeker spends the same amount of money for everything (well except for a outfitter) as his nr peer.. The only people who can help to move the needle in Co are Co residents and a lot of new folks moving in want to hunt and need the opportunity to do so for everyones benefit.

For a little perspective...the strongest functing hunting advocacy groups in many states is the Outfitter's and Guide's Associations. I've sat in the room with people who work directly and indirectly with them, we are very good about griping about the industry and loss of access. However, if you as an outfitter were offered a new lease because the public trashed several roads on a ranch would you take it? I can think of 5 of these situations I am aware of without even counting hard. The guys doing the dumb stuff ruin a LOT of opportunity on good properties for the ones who won't trash it.

MOGA was HUGE part in pushing MTFWP to do away with Doe/Fawn tags for mule deer on public land in many areas. The association in Colorado doesn't swing that much weight politically, especially in comparison to what Wyoming and Montana have. End of the day they want big game animals on the landscape as much or more than we do. This doesn't mean they are perfect by any stretch, but they have a role to play.

With that said, Colorado's split for NR tags is the most generous in the West. The figure I have heard thrown around from recent discussions is that it takes adding roughly 13 resident hunters to make up the revenue and economic loss from losing one NR. Think of the implications on crowding if chasing revenue is the big motivator.

 

[ColoradoV]

Scott for perspective = Again Colorado is flush with cash. In fact we have so much in the system that 11, 22, 144 nr hunting dollars just don’t matter anymore and it is also a fact these dollars will matter less in the future. Also a question or what has the Colorado outfitters ever done for resident hunters?? Like ever….

Don’t worry i will wait for the answer ….

I know for a fact there has been an official ethics complaint filed by resident hunters against OUTFITTER Molly Hackett for improper representation on the commission. How do outfitters square that? Answer is they don’t as they have screwed resident hunters over for years….

Also have sat “in the room” and was an outfitter for 16 years so got an idea what is going on. The outfitters care about themselves and their money period end of story.

Or it is nice that wyo has 90-10 and I could care less about Montana outfitters as pertains to Colorado. So again what have Colorado outfitters done for resident hunters??