Meat hunting vs. Trophy hunting

Montana

Veteran member
Nov 3, 2011
1,104
400
Bitterroot Valley, MT.
"To me... trophy hunting IS the ethical thing to do. Harvest mature animals."

To me yes. That is the ethical thing to do. Again as my post stated "to me, where I live", a place you hunt from Sept 1st thru Jan 15th and can harvest 7 deer
The ethical thing to do is harvest mature animals. There is no reason to take younger deer. Doe or buck. Kids of course are another story.
 

xtreme

Very Active Member
Feb 25, 2011
859
4
Searcy, Arkansas 72143
I agree with you Montana. I have to admit when hunting for meat, I still won't kill a young buck and don't like to see some other hunter do that either. It happens.
 

Kentucky hunter

Active Member
Jul 22, 2013
275
0
loretto ky
Just wanted to say I'd ratter someone trophy hunt than what they do here shoot first thing they see just so they can say they got one an if your meat hunting whats wrong with doe or cow. I hunt for the hunt I know what I'm going to shoot when I see it, its not how big the antlers are or if it even has any its what it takes to get to that point in the hunt that matters.
 

lp2506

Member
Mar 21, 2013
75
0
MO
I am both. Whether you trophy or meat hunting its still hunting. Being in the outdoors and that's what its all about. IMO
 

Old Hunter

Banned
Dec 28, 2011
1,104
0
Buena Vista, Co.
Doe Management Equals Deer Management


By Kevin Holsonback, Wildlife Biologist, Black Warrior WMA

What does “doe management” mean? Among most wildlife professionals, doe management is synonymous with antlerless deer harvest. Antlerless harvest should be one of the most important components of a deer management plan. While most hunters and clubs realize the importance of managing bucks on their property, many fail to realize the importance of managing antlerless deer as well. Many things can be accomplished with an adequate antlerless harvest, all of which ultimately affect the buck population. A balanced sex ratio, shorter and earlier breeding season, increased reproduction and recruitment, and improved herd health are a few of the objectives that can be met with proper antlerless harvest.

Wildlife biologists often encounter concerns about antlerless harvest recommendations when assisting private landowners and hunting clubs with developing deer management plans. Hunters and landowners are often reluctant to harvest does because they are afraid they do not have enough deer. This misconception can often be dissuaded with sound information concerning general deer biology and the affects of antlerless harvest.

One population characteristic that is greatly affected by antlerless harvest is the adult sex ratio. Why is a balanced sex ratio important? If there are a disproportionate number of does in a deer herd, it is reasonable to assume all will not be bred in a timely manner. Many does will not breed and conceive on their first estrous cycle because there are not enough adult bucks in the population. These does may not be bred until their second, third or later estrus. The result is a long protracted breeding season. Also, these does will give birth later in the year than does that conceived during their first estrous cycle. These late summer, early fall born fawns typically encounter vegetation that is generally poorer in quality and quantity as it “hardens off” for winter. This causes most late born fawns to come out of their first winter in poorer condition than early born fawns. In addition, many late born bucks will have poorer antler development as 1½ year olds than fawns born earlier in the year. With an extremely unbalanced sex ratio, some does may not breed at all.

Too many does also means the bucks will have to do very little searching for breeding opportunities, reducing a hunter’s chance of seeing a buck. When the number of does greatly exceeds the number of bucks, the bucks do not have to compete for the right to breed. This reduces the number of rubs and scrapes observed during the hunting season. Prolonged breeding seasons wear bucks down more than a shorter, more intense rut. Bucks in this situation enter late winter and early spring in much poorer physical condition. These bucks face a much tougher recovery period in the spring and summer, which can affect antler development and body weights the following year.

A given habitat can only support a certain number of deer in healthy condition. If the number of deer exceeds this level, habitat degradation and poorer herd health result. About one-third of a deer herd should be removed each year to maintain the population at a stable level. If the sex ratio is balanced, doe harvest should make up between 40 and 60 percent of the overall harvest to maintain this healthy balance. After only a few years of aggressive antlerless harvest, doe sightings may decline. Many hunters fear the decreased sightings are a result of drastically reduced deer numbers, when in fact; they have only educated the surviving does with the increased hunting pressure.

Fawn production and recruitment typically increase as a result of doe management. Does usually begin breeding at 1½ years of age, and if healthy, will reproduce each year until they die. Fifty does in good condition produce more fawns than 100 unhealthy does. Additionally, fawns produced by healthy does tend to have higher survival rates than fawns born to does in poor condition.

When deciding to harvest does, hunters must be careful to avoid harvesting buck fawns or “button” bucks. This can easily be accomplished with just a little practice at identification. Hunters can learn to tell the difference between adult does and fawns by observing body shape and size. By waiting until several deer are present, a size comparison of the deer can be made. Additionally, adult does typically have longer and larger faces than fawns. The shape of the head on most buck fawns is flatter than a doe’s head and the developing pedicels or “buttons” are often visible upon close observation. Behavioral cues may help distinguish age classes of antlerless deer; fawns are usually more playful than adults and are generally not as cautious. Plus, fawns are often the first deer to arrive at a feeding area.

Managing antlerless deer harvest is just as important as managing buck harvest. As a matter of fact, a good deer management plan will always place equal importance on managing bucks and does. Often, in their attempt to meet harvest goals, hunters may forget that hunting does that have been pressured can be just as difficult as trying to harvest a mature buck. Don’t overlook this opportunity to enjoy a challenging and exciting hunt when trying to improve your deer herd.
 

TooFarEast

New Member
Mar 26, 2012
22
0
Charleston, SC

CrimsonArrow

Very Active Member
Feb 21, 2011
857
363
Minnesota
"To me... trophy hunting IS the ethical thing to do. Harvest mature animals."

To me yes. That is the ethical thing to do. Again as my post stated "to me, where I live", a place you hunt from Sept 1st thru Jan 15th and can harvest 7 deer
The ethical thing to do is harvest mature animals. There is no reason to take younger deer. Doe or buck. Kids of course are another story.
I'm all for letting young bucks grow up and reach their potential, but I won't hesitate to shoot a yearling doe for meat. A very good reason for that is excellent eating. Another reason is the amount of food it takes that yearling doe to reach, say 5 years of age. A doe that is already 3 or 4 years of age takes significantly less food to make it to 5 yrs. You can't control the feed that's already been eaten, but by taking a few younger animals, it increases the available food for the remaining herd, including trophy animals. That is basic ecology.
 

JEandAsGuide

Active Member
Dec 11, 2012
475
1
Zachary, LA
I guess I fall somewhere in the middle, if there is such a place. I used to be the guy everybody hates because a trophy was the only thing that mattered. I have nearly divided my family and gave my dad a heart attack over stupidity. My dad has leased the same land we hunt since the year I was born(83). Around the time I was in high school we started managing our bucks a little more. Each year the deer we killed got a little bigger. My freshman year in college, my dad killed a 144" buck. Not a monster when you hunt where most of y'all hunt but in south Louisiana, that's a stud! That buck did something to me. I seen the potential we had and went 5 years without pulling the trigger on a buck because nothing was big enough. I always kept up on management by killing a couple does with my bow each year but let every buck I seen walk. My older brother who lives out of state now would come over for holidays and shoot a young buck every year, most of which were bucks I had already let walk that year. He would be so excited and I crushed the excitement every time. Holidays around my parents house wasn't the fun time it was supposed to be and I was 100% to blame. The only way my dad could shut me up was threaten to drop the lease. Since i was in college i couldnt afford to pick it up. Then I finally killed a buck that I considered a trophy for where I hunt. All I could think was, its not worth it. The only thing that made that buck special was it was the first buck i killed, with my dad in the woods also, in a very long time. I will be the first to say I was wrong. Even though he is 10 years older than me, he never hunted as hard as me so his meaning of a trophy wasn't the same as mine. I was too immature to see that. Since then apologies have been made and now we are closer than ever. He has sent me a text message everyday for the pasted 2 months of a number. That number being the number of days until we leave for WY together for the first time. This morning it was 13. I still hunt for what I think is a trophy but I will always try to fill a doe tag for the meat. I picked up a leftover cow elk tag in my mule deer area this year because I have never cooked elk and I really want to try it. I am also looking forward to the pack out so I can see what all you guys have been talking about :)
 

In God We Trust

Very Active Member
Mar 10, 2011
805
0
Colorado
I am a hybrid trophy hunter I guess. I hunt where pack outs are long and the terrain is rough so I will not shoot a deer or bull under the age of 3 years old anymore. I say anymore because growing up I shot any buck or bull I would see. Now the urge to shoot any buck or bull is gone, I like to challenge myself by taking mature bucks and bulls, plus this usually extends my season. I still fill the freezer every year because I buy an extra cow and doe tag for meat tags. I do not fault anyone for taking younger class animals and I feel this is another "live and let live" hunting situation kind of like the other argumentative topics we have debated on this forum. As long as you do not make hunting competitive to the point you quit enjoying it then I say do it the way you choose. One thing I hate is people putting down other hunters for not shooting animals that do not meet a size standard, especially new hunters and youth. I say you shoot the buck you think is worth your tag and I will shoot the buck I think is worth my tag. Then at the end of the hunt we shake hands, say congratulations, and all look forward to next season.
 

birdhunter

Active Member
May 8, 2011
226
0
Black Hills, Wy
A lot of people on here ask if I'm a trophy hunter, why don't I just shoot does. Well it's simple. In the black hills of wyo, it is illegal to harvest a doe/fawn on public land. Besides, I would much rather shoot a young buck besides an old doe that has had a few fawns in her days. An old doe can be just as tough to eat as a mature rutting buck. When the opportunity arrives, I can and do get a doe tag and harvest one for meat. But remember, some areas don't allow the harvest of does. Got to be one of the few areas out there that don't allow hunting does. I would be glad to go onto private land and shoot one but they are 95% outfitted and can't get onto the land. I would say that 90% of the people born and raised in NE Wyo are completely happy with meat hunting and the rules and regs we hunt by. Lots of meat hunters around here. The most popular hunting phrase around here is "don't pass up on the first day what you wouldn't on the last day". Lots of people live by those words around here.
 

Musket Man

Veteran member
Jul 20, 2011
6,457
0
colfax, wa
Im leaving for not to far from Gillette as soon as it stops raining enough to finish planting wheat. Wanted to leave today but prob will be lucky to get on the road by early next week the way things are going.
 

Ilovethewest

Active Member
Jul 11, 2012
169
0
Wisconsin
mule deer by Gillette musket man? antelope? we are b/w Gillette and buffalo mule deer hunting. public land. always nervous b/c you never know how bad the pressure was in the early season or how bad it will be when we get there. The last 2 hunts we have seen few people. hope that trend continues. Region C had more tags cut again this year, so that would hopefully equal lower hunting pressure. we are hunting the last week of the season (ends oct 20th). Accuweathers long range forcast has highs in the low 50's and lows in the 30's. Hoping they are right. That will be great hunting weather.

gotta check my trail cam on Wisconsin public land tomorrow. have to chain and padlock it to avoid people stealing. Hope I get a few bucks on camera. will post some pictures if I do. its an older camera with avg quality. cant figure out how to set the date, so the pics will show that it is still March. LOL
 

Musket Man

Veteran member
Jul 20, 2011
6,457
0
colfax, wa
I will be between Gilette and Buffalo as well hunting antelope. I have 1 buck and 1 doe tag. I applied for deer 2nd choice but didnt draw due to the tag cuts. I was hoping to make the 10/1 opener but as I sit here listening to it rain and I have wheat to plant before I can leave I realize thats not going to happen.