More Elk Tags for WYOMING!

mallardsx2

Veteran member
Jul 8, 2015
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An increase of 2,000 elk tags on the statewide quota would mean nearly 320 additional nonresident elk hunters will be heading afield this fall season in pursuit of elk.

This move could help to stifle the point creep seen over the past half a decade inside the Wyoming tag draw system by increasing the nonresident elk hunting opportunity by nearly 17% if all of the additional tags were limited quota bull elk tags.


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3....2....1.....BuzzH
 

BuzzH

Very Active Member
Apr 15, 2015
910
953
An increase of 2,000 elk tags on the statewide quota would mean nearly 320 additional nonresident elk hunters will be heading afield this fall season in pursuit of elk.

This move could help to stifle the point creep seen over the past half a decade inside the Wyoming tag draw system by increasing the nonresident elk hunting opportunity by nearly 17% if all of the additional tags were limited quota bull elk tags.


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3....2....1.....BuzzH
Shows how little you both know about the NR/R elk draw.

First of all, there isn't anything in the article about what type the 2k additional tags are, full priced (type 1, 2, 4, or 9) or how many are reduced priced (6, 7). From looking at the regs, a majority are cow/calf, but for sure some full priced as well.

Any increase in full price LQ tags simply means less general tags...the 7,250 cap doesn't change so there won't be 320 additional full price NR elk hunters this year even if all 320 were full priced. I'm fine with increased LQ tags, that just means less NR's in general areas...but still capped at 7250.

It also may or may not do a thing for point creep. It may reduce some creep in the LQ side, which drives point creep up on the general tags. Any of the reduced priced cow/calf tags won't do a thing for point creep since there is no points for those tags.

Its just a shift in where the 7,250 full price tags come from...I see nothing wrong with that.

This is good news when 90-10 passes though, 1800 more tags for R's and 200 more for NR's. Even as is, 1,680 are set aside for Residents...all but assures me 3 elk tags a year, and that's a great thing. The price is right as well, I usually have 2 full priced tags and a cow/calf...all for less than $160.
 
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Hilltop

Veteran member
Feb 25, 2014
3,798
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Eastern Nebraska
Shows how little you both know about the NR/R elk draw.

First of all, there isn't anything in the article about what type the 2k additional tags are, full priced (type 1, 2, 4, or 9) or how many are reduced priced (6, 7). From looking at the regs, a majority are cow/calf, but for sure some full priced as well.

Any increase in full price LQ tags simply means less general tags...the 7,250 cap doesn't change so there won't be 320 additional full price NR elk hunters this year even if all 320 were full priced. I'm fine with increased LQ tags, that just means less NR's in general areas...but still capped at 7250.

It also may or may not do a thing for point creep. It may reduce some creep in the LQ side, which drives point creep up on the general tags. Any of the reduced priced cow/calf tags won't do a thing for point creep since there is no points for those tags.

Its just a shift in where the 7,250 full price tags come from...I see nothing wrong with that.

This is good news when 90-10 passes though, 1800 more tags for R's and 200 more for NR's. Even as is, 1,680 are set aside for Residents...all but assures me 3 elk tags a year, and that's a great thing. The price is right as well, I usually have 2 full priced tags and a cow/calf...all for less than $160.
Your knowledge is typically appreciated. Your attitude is another story.

You still haven't answered an important question. Do you support a 90/10 split based on total numbers?
 

Hilltop

Veteran member
Feb 25, 2014
3,798
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Eastern Nebraska
I support a 90/10 split. Wyoming has been overly generous to the non resident for decades.
Two ways to calculate a 90/10 split... For instance let's say there is 200 moose permits. A true 90/10 split would give non-residents 20 permits. The other way is by area. If viewing by area, non-residents would only get a permit if the area offered at least 10 permits. Under an area system, non-residents would get significantly fewer than 20 permits. That's what many pushing for 90/10 are asking for but won't come out and say it because it would be met with even more opposition. In reality it would end up being approximately 93/7.
 

mustang8

Active Member
Jan 30, 2017
284
72
Central WI
It will be interesting if the 90-10 split were to happen and there be substantially less NR's that are able to pay over the top price tags compared to residents and if at some point the residents get mad that fish and game hike their prices to make up the difference in $. Someone has to pay the bills and if its not the residents who else could it be? Just a question :)
 

mallardsx2

Veteran member
Jul 8, 2015
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It will be interesting if the 90-10 split were to happen and there be substantially less NR's that are able to pay over the top price tags compared to residents and if at some point the residents get mad that fish and game hike their prices to make up the difference in $. Someone has to pay the bills and if its not the residents who else could it be? Just a question :)

They better have boats available to all of the citizens of Wyoming because the river of tears will run high. lol
 

BuzzH

Very Active Member
Apr 15, 2015
910
953
It will be interesting if the 90-10 split were to happen and there be substantially less NR's that are able to pay over the top price tags compared to residents and if at some point the residents get mad that fish and game hike their prices to make up the difference in $. Someone has to pay the bills and if its not the residents who else could it be? Just a question :)
Won't have to raise Resident liceses much...been discussed how to make up the revenue and its not a big deal...Add $10 to all the full priced Resident licenses and $3 to an annual Resident fishing license and you're well past the revenue loss to 90-10 going for all species.

If 90-10 only were applied to full price LQ elk, moose, sheep, goat, bison...the revenue loss isn't even a rounding error in an 80+ million dollar budget.

The loss in revenue card being played by NR's with 90-10 is wayyyyy over-played.
 

wy-tex

Veteran member
May 2, 2016
1,059
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SE Wyoming
Many resident hunters support higher fees for more licenses. mallardsx2 your tears may be all we see.

By the way mallards lots of teal around our area right now, cinnamons are really pretty . Saw some cranes too, outside of town.
 
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mustang8

Active Member
Jan 30, 2017
284
72
Central WI
I understand that the license prices wouldn't be the end of the world but I'm guessing if you factor in all the other money that could be lost with food, hotels, guides etc. There is probably more of a difference than you'd think. And please don't get me wrong, i really don't give a dam what they decide to do. Lots of places to hunt :)
 

BuzzH

Very Active Member
Apr 15, 2015
910
953
I understand that the license prices wouldn't be the end of the world but I'm guessing if you factor in all the other money that could be lost with food, hotels, guides etc. There is probably more of a difference than you'd think. And please don't get me wrong, i really don't give a dam what they decide to do. Lots of places to hunt :)
Right, because 7,250 full priced elk tags going to NR's now, versus 7,250 full priced tags going to NR's under 90-10 is different?

How does the same number of NR elk hunters under both systems equal less revenue for hotels, guides, food, etc.?

Its no difference...not a bit.
 
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Hilltop

Veteran member
Feb 25, 2014
3,798
2,170
Eastern Nebraska
Right, because 7,250 full priced elk tags going to NR's now, versus 7,250 full priced tags going to NR's under 90-10 is different?

How does the same number of NR elk hunters under both systems equal less revenue for hotels, guides, food, etc.?

Its no difference...not a bit.
The numbers stay the same but the allocations per area would be very different. More of those tags would be general tags. You know guys are less likely to pay for guided hunts on general tags so there would be fewer guides hired yearly for elk. As to other species, there would be reductions and a loss of revenue in the areas mustang mentioned. The lost revenue likely wouldn't be substantial enough to dissuade the argument but there is no reason to not tell the whole truth. Local economies will be impacted when 90/10 passes.
 
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wy-tex

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May 2, 2016
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SE Wyoming
I'm not so sure Hilltop. If we as a resident draw a nice LG tag we will hunt it hard, buy supplies and yes even maybe stay in a hotel.
Lots of general areas are conducive to NR hiring guides, wilderness areas and grizz come to mind. Plenty of private land in general areas too that is leased or owned by outfitters that residents do not get to hunt.
Trips across the state have expenses for residents just like NR, yes we may buy part of our supplies in our home towns just as hunters in those other small towns gear up for their LQ hunts.
Plenty of outfitted hunters never spend a dime in the small towns near their hunting areas, of course many do though.
 

Hilltop

Veteran member
Feb 25, 2014
3,798
2,170
Eastern Nebraska
I'm not so sure Hilltop. If we as a resident draw a nice LG tag we will hunt it hard, buy supplies and yes even maybe stay in a hotel.
Lots of general areas are conducive to NR hiring guides, wilderness areas and grizz come to mind. Plenty of private land in general areas too that is leased or owned by outfitters that residents do not get to hunt.
Trips across the state have expenses for residents just like NR, yes we may buy part of our supplies in our home towns just as hunters in those other small towns gear up for their LQ hunts.
Plenty of outfitted hunters never spend a dime in the small towns near their hunting areas, of course many do though.
Of course there will be exceptions but the fact is a good portion of residents will typically apply for the hunts closer to home- spending considerably less. There are studies and data to back this up if you care to research. Yes, there are guided hunts in general areas... but not near as many as there are in LQ areas. The amount charged for those guided general hunts is also considerably less on average. Like I said, the amount lost likely won't be enough to sway the argument but it's ridiculous for Buzz, or anyone else, to say there will be no financial impact to local economies.
 
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Alan Leone

New Member
Jan 19, 2021
25
26
I don't think Wy residents care as much about the 90/10 split. The economic impact from outdoorsman's helps regardless of residency. What we care about, or at least I care is the outfitters and landowners locking down swaths of public land access so the if you aren't using a outfitter than public land is off limits to residents and NR alike. There are hundreds if not thousands of miles of public land that landowners and outfitters have worked to lease, buy or trade with the legislators to prevent access by not allowing corner crossing.
 
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