The Long Shot... Take it or Leave it?

[highplainsdrifter]

The longest shot I've taken was 380 yards at a sheep...across a small canyon. We tried to get closer by sneaking downhill and crossing the stream, but when we got to the other side the contour of slope made it impossible to see the sheep. So we went back to the starting spot to take the shot. Fortunately, it was a clean kill. I felt pretty confident in the shot, because I had been practicing out to 400 yards at the rifle range and there was no wind.

The word "confident" is important. That will depend on how much you have practiced, wind conditions, size of the animal, etc. Unlike "targets", animals can move so ethics demand you get reasonably close before you take the shot. For me that is usually 300 yards or less...often a lot less. I'd guess the average distance for all big game animals I've shot with a rifle is about 150 yards. I also archery hunt, so getting close is run-of-the-mill and part of the thrill.

 

[HuskyMusky]

they say 400 is the new 300yds. So either way you slice it, 300-400yds is a long shot! especially for probably 90%+ of us.

if you have the rifle and skills, to each their own.

personally I'd like to shoot something less than 300yds, perhaps one day with practice etc... I'd be fine with 300-600yds.


I saw a tv show once where the kid shot something like 900yds, the dad carried the rifle, which was big heavy long range set up, the dad adjusted the scope drop etc... granted the kid, made the shot, but IMO the dad took out 95% of the hunting experience.

it's kind of humorous to me that, hunting can be one of the toughest challenges out there, or it can be shooting fish in a barrel, depending on one's circumstances.

 

[mallardsx2]

they say 400 is the new 300yds. So either way you slice it, 300-400yds is a long shot! especially for probably 90%+ of us.

if you have the rifle and skills, to each their own.

personally I'd like to shoot something less than 300yds, perhaps one day with practice etc... I'd be fine with 300-600yds.


I saw a tv show once where the kid shot something like 900yds, the dad carried the rifle, which was big heavy long range set up, the dad adjusted the scope drop etc... granted the kid, made the shot, but IMO the dad took out 95% of the hunting experience.

it's kind of humorous to me that, hunting can be one of the toughest challenges out there, or it can be shooting fish in a barrel, depending on one's circumstances.

Not trying to change the subject but, welcome to the "Youth hunt".

I was at the taxidermist the other day when this young kid was telling me about him and his dads turkey hunt where he got a youth tag but his dad shot the turkey because he couldn't see it. His dad was hissing at him telling him to be quiet. Kids are so brutally honest. lol

If I had a dollar for every time I heard a story just like that. I'm not saying it happens with most people but that story plays out a lot more than people will admit.

 

[SansSouci]

Hi BHunt998,

Excellent post!

Just because we might be able to do something doesn't make it ethical.

I have a self-imposed shooting distance of 400 yards. But conditions would have to be perfect, which means no wind, a solid rest, a stationary animal, no other animals around it, and no ability to close distance. I'd rather shoot at a hundred yards than farther.

I have a 7MM Rem Mag. It will shoot much father than I'm capable. A hunter has to know his limitations...and ethics. I know my limitations. And I know what an ethical shot would be for me.

Bench shooting is a whole lot different than hunting at Rocky Mountain altitude. I could probably shoot a thousand yards from a bench and hit steel. But that's a whole lot different than shooting 300 yards at high altitude with labored breathing.

I could not imagine carrying a 15 pound or heavier super long range rifle up-and-down high ridges of the Rockies. I'd much rather carry a .308 Win carbine.

I'd good with rifles other hunters choose. They know what's right for them.

 

[SansSouci]

Not trying to change the subject but, welcome to the "Youth hunt".

I was at the taxidermist the other day when this young kid was telling me about him and his dads turkey hunt where he got a youth tag but his dad shot the turkey because he couldn't see it. His dad was hissing at him telling him to be quiet. Kids are so brutally honest. lol

If I had a dollar for every time I heard a story just like that. I'm not saying it happens with most people but that story plays out a lot more than people will admit.

What was his dad teaching his son? That's it's OK to cheat?

I've passed on shots, one on a very large, possibly book size bull elk because I couldn't get a clear shot. My guide asked me why I didn't shoot. I told him that a huge branch was between the bull and me. He understood. I did shoot a 374 bull on that evening's hunt. I had a clear, unobstructed shot at his heart, which is where a 160 grain Partition impacted.

Not having a clear shot is no excuse for cheating. The right answer is to not shoot, and hope for a clear shot later. Cheating is never the right answer.

 

[JimP]

It all comes down to ethics of what you are capable of shooting along with the rifles capabilities.

Some don't agree with any shot over 200 yards while others want to shoot everything over 200 yards. Where do we draw the line at as far as it is legal.

Bow hunters put rifle hunters down all the time. Some think that bow hunting is the purest way of hunting and anything else is just killing. Well, how about the bow hunters that are now taking 100+ yard shots? How about the argument between a longbow and a recurve? The recurve ad the compound, the dual cam set up vrs the single cam, the 80% let off vrs the 40% let off.

Were do we finally draw the line about what is ethical and what isn't. It is a argument that has been happening for years and will happen for years to come.

I believe in was in this thread where someone mentioned that the Native Americans were killing game animals with rocks, spears, and bows for a long time before a firearm came along. That is correct, but they were also driving those same animals over cliffs and letting the animals fall to their death.

When it comes down to it dead is dead.

 

[missjordan]

Long shots are a hot topic for debate among lots of hunters and some people will just scrutinize you to death over a number. In my opinion i like the long range shots for a few different reasons:
1.) the animal is calm and most likely doesn?t even know you are there. Or the distance between you and them isn?t threatening

2.) with the distance in mind, animals don?t feel pressured and usually give you more than enough time to double, triple, and quadruple check your ballistics (and get comfortable)

In my hunting career so far, I?ve taken 4 animals at long range and tons more at close range and I?m way more comfortable with the long range shots because i don?t have to rush anything. And i struggle even with a light gun to make off hand shots, it?s not something I?m comfortable with. One long shot that comes to mind we had to sit and wait for 3 hours for the perfect time to take the shot. The elk were feeding all morning while we were watching and it was quite peaceful.

As a person, if you are extremely comfortable with your firearm, and also put the time in during the off season. Then I say go for it. Get as close as you can but if you absolutely can?t get closer, then make sure you have the skills, confidence, proper equipment, and the math to take the shot anyways.

Im also a fan of the big magnum cartridges for the longer ranges. I absolutely love the 338 Lapua as a hunting round. It?s a combination that?s been fantastic for me and mine is packable for the size


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[LaHunter]

some need the time to build a nest before shooting. that's ok, better to wait for the shot you are comfortable with.

I have been known to take ,a running shot but will not take just any running shot.


sometimes I take into consideration how far I have run. have even been known to stop running before I shoot.

Pretty funny!

 

[Timberstalker]

The only time I ever got Pissed at another hunter was on an elk hunt in hell’s canyon. I was literally running to get to the elk before they did and once I got within 600 yards I had to slow down to sneak in to my 400 yard comfort zone. At 405 I was taking my last deep breath and about about to squeeze the trigger when the elk all bolted. I look behind me and there were the hunters skylined behind me. I went back to them and they were pissed at me for taking so long to shoot. They were going to shoot over my head at 700 yards at what ever bull I didn’t drop in it’s tracks. They said the use 7mm for close shots, 700 or less and .50 cal for up to 1200. The had 10 tags in their camp and every hunter packed rifles till all tags were filled. You could tell when they saw elk for miles around, bang, bang, BOOM! Bang, bang, BOOM! yes they would keep shooting till the elk made it over the next ridge. What a bunch of jack asses

 

[rammont]

Most of us overestimate our marksmanship skills, quite often we think that because we can hit paper or steel out to 1000 yards from a bench we could easily hit an elk at 600 yards in the field. The reality is that field shooting at an animal just isn't the same as sitting calmly at a bench and shooting at an inanimate object at a known distance.

I have a friend that comes over from another state and he assured me for 2 years that he could easily hit an elk from any shooting situation/position with his .300 Short Mag at any range out to about 600 yards. I kept trying to get him to practice from a field position on my property before elk season started but he was very confident that he didn't need to waste his time. Last season he learned the hard way that shooting a good sized bull at over 300 yards isn't as easy as most people believe (which is surprising since he claimed to have taken "many" elk). He made two attempts at two different elk over two consecutive days at around 380 yards and he missed both times. I finally convinced him to use his pack as a rest and to get on his belly to make the shot. On the third day he finally got his elk with a 283 yard shot from a prone position over his pack.

I simply don't see any reason to take a shot past 400 yards, you aren't starving so it's not like you need to take the animal in order to survive, other than survival, there is absolutely no reason to HAVE to take a longer shot. Those that need to brag about those long range shots have no compassion or concern for the value of the life that they take, they think that taking those kinds of shots make them better than those that don't. For me they haven't got anything to brag about because I don't consider them hunters. It's not hunting when you can just lay there and take multiple shots at the animal and it doesn't even know it's life is in danger. Hunting is all about knowing your prey and being able to work your way close to it by using your knowledge about it's habits and needs. If I were limited to using a bow or a handgun then I wouldn't have a problem with having to make my shots at less than 100 yards, yes, my hunts would be much more difficult and I'd go home empty handed more often but I know I'd still enjoy the hunt.

 

[packer58]

As a person, if you are extremely comfortable with your firearm, and also put the time in during the off season. Then I say go for it. Get as close as you can but if you absolutely can?t get closer, then make sure you have the skills, confidence, proper equipment, and the math to take the shot anyways.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

My feelings exactly ^^^^^^^

 

[kidoggy]

Most of us overestimate our marksmanship skills, quite often we think that because we can hit paper or steel out to 1000 yards from a bench we could easily hit an elk at 600 yards in the field. The reality is that field shooting at an animal just isn't the same as sitting calmly at a bench and shooting at an inanimate object at a known distance.

I have a friend that comes over from another state and he assured me for 2 years that he could easily hit an elk from any shooting situation/position with his .300 Short Mag at any range out to about 600 yards. I kept trying to get him to practice from a field position on my property before elk season started but he was very confident that he didn't need to waste his time. Last season he learned the hard way that shooting a good sized bull at over 300 yards isn't as easy as most people believe (which is surprising since he claimed to have taken "many" elk). He made two attempts at two different elk over two consecutive days at around 380 yards and he missed both times. I finally convinced him to use his pack as a rest and to get on his belly to make the shot. On the third day he finally got his elk with a 283 yard shot from a prone position over his pack.

I simply don't see any reason to take a shot past 400 yards, you aren't starving so it's not like you need to take the animal in order to survive, other than survival, there is absolutely no reason to HAVE to take a longer shot. Those that need to brag about those long range shots have no compassion or concern for the value of the life that they take, they think that taking those kinds of shots make them better than those that don't. For me they haven't got anything to brag about because I don't consider them hunters. It's not hunting when you can just lay there and take multiple shots at the animal and it doesn't even know it's life is in danger. Hunting is all about knowing your prey and being able to work your way close to it by using your knowledge about it's habits and needs. If I were limited to using a bow or a handgun then I wouldn't have a problem with having to make my shots at less than 100 yards, yes, my hunts would be much more difficult and I'd go home empty handed more often but I know I'd still enjoy the hunt.

I don't entirely disagree with your thinking,but I would stop short of saying they are not hunters.

hunting is to seek something to kill and then kill it.

I know most get all warm and fuzzy , saying it's not about the kill. that is true ,it is NOT ENTIRELY ABOUT THE KILL. but let's be honest ,the kill IS the goal we ALL strive for.

who am I ,or you to say what others do is not hunting.

far as I am concerned, if legal, it is ethical.
just because it is not something we would do, does not give us the right to tell others they can not.
we do however have the right to be unimpressed

I also am not fond of shooting at long ranges but there are many out there that are very capable of doing it.


I am certain that no mater what you hunt or how you do it ,there is someone who will say what you are doing is "unethical".

 

[jtm307]

far as I am concerned, if legal, it is ethical.

I can think of a few exceptions to that.

I limit myself to 300 yards. Sneaking up to animals if half the fun.

 

[CrimsonArrow]

The reason I only bowhunt is to be as close to the animal as possible. I believe it intensifies some primal link between predator and prey. I am strongly against any shot at game that takes the projectile longer than 1/2 second to reach the animal. Even calm animals can unexpectedly move a good distance in that amount of time.

 

[kidoggy]

The reason I only bowhunt is to be as close to the animal as possible. I believe it intensifies some primal link between predator and prey. I am strongly against any shot at game that takes the projectile longer than 1/2 second to reach the animal. Even calm animals can unexpectedly move a good distance in that amount of time.

(shrug)same thing can happen when shooting with a bow at ten. string jump??????????

if one has time to study an animals behavior from a distance ,one can time the shot and be relatively certain the animal will stand still,till bullet gets there .
no situation is a 100% certainty.(cept death an taxes) that's why folks practice. to achieve the skill that gives them the best chance to make that clean kill, regardless of the type hunting they enjoy.

 

[kidoggy]

I can think of a few exceptions to that.

I limit myself to 300 yards. Sneaking up to animals if half the fun.

agreed , it is.

I can think of no exceptions . what are yours?

 

[ivorytip]

Interesting thread. I bow hunt and rifle hunt. There is something about hunting mule deer with a rifle that is just in my blood. With a good solid rest I won't hesitate taking a 400yard shot at a buck. But that's my max. I've watched my brother drop deer at much longer distances that I would never attempt but he has the rifle and scope combo and endless shooting hours behind his shots and it always amazes me. I enjoy getting as close as I can, that is fun for me but sometimes you catch yourself on an open hillside and glass a group of deer up in an unexpected spot not giving you many options than to shoot or watch them run if you creep any closer. One of my favorite hunts my son was with me, his first time out while in was after deer. This same scenario played out and a small but perfectly semetrical typical 4 was feeding with some smaller bucks. I love typicals of all sizes! 390 was the range and I didn't dare sneak closer but I was able to get into prone and use backpack as a rest. With son watching through my binos that buck dropped hard and fast. With these amazing optics we have a 400 yard shot really isnt all that far. Confidence earned through knowledge of your skill and weapon is key. But you must stick to your limits.

 

[Ikeepitcold]

Practice and a dead steady rest is paramount. I’ve missed Antelope and deer at 200 yards laying prone with my rifle on a back pack. Not my best days in the field but have to admit my issues. Now I use a bi pod and a rear bag to keep my gun dead steady.
I can shoot at the range to 1300y with very good results but it’s day and night compared to the field then the range. No way in gods green earth would I attempt a shot that far at a big game animal.

 

[BHunt98]

You can?t put a number on ethics. I personally like to get as close as I can with what ever weapon I carry. I?m more apt to brag about how close my shot is than how far. I rely way more on my hunting skills than my shooting skills.

Some may think it?s unethical to shoot at a running deer, I?ve killed quite a few Blacktail on the run, we used to make drives and that?s what the shot was. I see show where they say ?now wait till it turns broadside and take the shot? I would have already been gutting the deer out by the time they decided to shoot.

I personally am not a fan of long range shooting. Not for rifles, muzzleloader or bow. Give the animals a sporting chance.

Like the underlined quote

 

[Prerylyon]

Not my bag, but, if you have the rig AND the skills to reliably make clean kills at 'long range' I'm not gonna stop ya...

Thing, is, many may see a TV program with 500+ yard kill shots and not take the skills and rig part to heart.

I saw my tent mate make a 550+ yard kill shot on a bull on an outfitted mountain hunt some years ago But, he was lobbing ICBMs at it with a tricked out Weatherby 30-378 and he clearly knew how to use it.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337Z using Tapatalk