Non-resident tag fees out of control!

[Wapiti slayer .270]

Not going to endear myself to alot of guys on this.

I vote C and D.

Its true that its federal land. Everyone both Res and Non Res can come and go as they want. The game belongs to the state and that's just the way it is. Like many here I will not be able to hunt my home unit yearly during my season of preference due to the changing of the tag allocations. It truly sucks since we've been doing it from 2 decades onto 4 plus depending on which guy you talk to in camp. Like many others I volunteer to help any way I can both through organizations and on with local ranchers/farmers.

I have said it on other forums and I'll say it here. I think that if many of the non residents from the east had to face what us residents have to face when it comes to tags and being able to hunt, these conversations wouldn't crop up very much. Just in case that is a bit murky, ask yourself how you'd feel if you couldn't hunt your own state, country, town every year since your tag was allocated to someone else. I know CO has OTC tags and we are unique in that regards. However, guys in MT, WY, UT, NM, AZ and such run into that issue a ton. Granted a few have general tags but you are often times forced to hunt somewhere you don't normally do.

Personally I feel they could open the flood gates to NR's provided that the residents are guaranteed the hunts of their choice. Trophy Units notwithstanding.

BTW, Ric and Old Hunter,

IF you guys ever meet up in the Fort, let me know. I wouldn't mind joining into the meet up if possible.

 

[xtreme]

My problem is I have property In Colorado, my jeep is tagged in Co. I pay a lot of taxes in Co. I use to spend at least one monthof the year in Co. I still have to pay full non resident fees.
Last year I had a NM bear tag and mule deer tag. I drove to Co to hunt in NM but an illness caused me to cancel hunting before the season opened for deer and the bear tag had only been good for 4 hours before seasoned closed. I cant afford these cost on a gamble that everything will work out. I can get into the woods/mountains with a camera and have almost as much fun as hunting with a gun. I can also kill lots of paper and not have to drag/carry a game animal. All I would be doing is opening a slot for someone else. Thats okay I had over forty years of nonresident hunting and enjoyed it.
Some states have landowner tags, that would be more fair.

 

[Fink]

I have said it on other forums and I'll say it here. I think that if many of the non residents from the east had to face what us residents have to face when it comes to tags and being able to hunt, these conversations wouldn't crop up very much.

I would blow a gasket if I were unable to deer hunt my farm on an annual basis... Although, there are probably more whitetails in Missouri than there are elk in the US.. It is unfortunate that the resource is so limited, but I think that overall states do a fairly good job of managing the resource, and providing opportunity for both the resident and non resident hunters.

 

[Old Hunter]

Not going to endear myself to alot of guys on this.

I vote C and D.

Its true that its federal land. Everyone both Res and Non Res can come and go as they want. The game belongs to the state and that's just the way it is. Like many here I will not be able to hunt my home unit yearly during my season of preference due to the changing of the tag allocations. It truly sucks since we've been doing it from 2 decades onto 4 plus depending on which guy you talk to in camp. Like many others I volunteer to help any way I can both through organizations and on with local ranchers/farmers.

I have said it on other forums and I'll say it here. I think that if many of the non residents from the east had to face what us residents have to face when it comes to tags and being able to hunt, these conversations wouldn't crop up very much. Just in case that is a bit murky, ask yourself how you'd feel if you couldn't hunt your own state, country, town every year since your tag was allocated to someone else. I know CO has OTC tags and we are unique in that regards. However, guys in MT, WY, UT, NM, AZ and such run into that issue a ton. Granted a few have general tags but you are often times forced to hunt somewhere you don't normally do.

Personally I feel they could open the flood gates to NR's provided that the residents are guaranteed the hunts of their choice. Trophy Units notwithstanding.

BTW, Ric and Old Hunter,

IF you guys ever meet up in the Fort, let me know. I wouldn't mind joining into the meet up if possible.

Is the hunting any good on your property? If it is. You should be able to get a voucher, and use it yourself. I believe you get 1 voucher for every 160 acres.

 

[CasNed]

Even if game is on federal land, letting them choose the price of tags...scary thought..
Whats the advantage of living in a norther state if you have to pay the price of a non-res, but why should non-res have to pay 43x that is steep.
My vote C.

 

[Murdy]

Tough call. I get the point that you don't want non-residients overrunning your local hunting areas. As an Illinois resident, we attract a large number of NR's, and gouge the heck out of them to be able to hunt whitetails here. But then I think, we're all Americans. Why is it that someone from Chicago, who has no real ties to the area I hunt, be able to hunt it for less than $40, but someone from Milwaukee, who's just across an artificial border, has to spend over $400. Why does state residency trump Amercian citizenship? If a state wants to insure locals have adequate access, it can do it by controlling permit numbers rather than gouging NR's.

 

[200/400]

I'm new to forum and really liked all the comments and points of view. One has to ask what you get for your $ when plunking down serious amounts for a nr tag. Here in Colorado you get 17 to 18% success ratio on bulls, you get to fight crowds you get an outfitters camp on practically every drainage and many other fun things to contend with. For similar tag fees you can have a much better hunt in other states. I put in for wyo and utah (much better everything) and for the life of me can't understand why so many nr's put up with the poor hunting experiences here in colo. Yes you get ripped-off everytime you buy a nr tag here but it doesn't stop you does it? CPW did a "Willingness to Pay" study several years ago. This study provided valuable data on just how much a nr will or will not pay. There is your science behind colo's recent fee increase. There really never will be any correlation between res and nr fees the way I see it. The fees you pay are high because you are willing to pay it mine are low to keep me and other res's from full scale rioting!

 

[Wapiti slayer .270]

Is the hunting any good on your property? If it is. You should be able to get a voucher, and use it yourself. I believe you get 1 voucher for every 160 acres.

I do not personally own any land as of yet. I hope I didn't give that impression.

For a long time I helped out other members of the RMEF that I knew. Nowadays there is a small group of folks who kind of watch out for each other and one of them is a guy I used to work for. He owns 160 acres but doesn't hunt.

 

[Old Hunter]

Sorry Wapiti. I meant to quote xtreme.

 

[Wapiti slayer .270]

Sorry Wapiti. I meant to quote xtreme.

No worries.

I think you are on a good thought though. If he owns enough property he can get that voucher!

 

[Doe Nob]

I don't mind paying a lot of money for a good tag. I don't mind paying a decent amount for a preference point.

I do mind paying a lot of money for a hunting license I won't use if I don't draw and I also mind paying a bunch of money for a tag in a crummy area where there are way too many hunters and not enough game.

I think the answer to this is to have a sliding price scale on tags in the state. The best tags cost the most money, the tags that aren't so great cost a lot less. Apply this both to residents and non-residents. Residents have the ability to learn the less popular units and still have a good season year after year. As a non-resident I don't, I can spend maybe a week scouting or I can hire a guide to help me out. Seems fair to me

I would guess most Eastman's subscribers apply in multiple states every year.

 

[Old Hunter]

I don't mind paying a lot of money for a good tag. I don't mind paying a decent amount for a preference point.

I do mind paying a lot of money for a hunting license I won't use if I don't draw and I also mind paying a bunch of money for a tag in a crummy area where there are way too many hunters and not enough game.

I think the answer to this is to have a sliding price scale on tags in the state. The best tags cost the most money, the tags that aren't so great cost a lot less. Apply this both to residents and non-residents. Residents have the ability to learn the less popular units and still have a good season year after year. As a non-resident I don't, I can spend maybe a week scouting or I can hire a guide to help me out. Seems fair to me

I would guess most Eastman's subscribers apply in multiple states every year.

I don't like that idea. That would flood some areas with applications, and leave the good areas for the rich.

 

[Doe Nob]

Yep - free market economics - supply and demand. When demand exceeds supply, prices must rise. Not every tag in every state is over subscribed, mostly we are talking about the trophy units where people can't get tags.

A lot of people, myself included, would be happy to just get to go hunting every year. Throw in a trophy hunt every now and then when i can afford it, but to me its just as good to get out there. Now if the odds of filling my tag are something like 18% and there's 400 other hunters in my unit, then I don't think its fair for me to pay out the nose for that privilege.

And I don't want to sound elitist, but at 69 if you can still get around the mountains and pack out a deer, there are a lot of seasonal jobs you could do during the spring/summer to get enough money to be able to at least drive to a different unit. Not trying to be a jerk, I've just found if you want something bad enough, you will find a way to make it happen.

 

[Wapiti slayer .270]

Sorry, didn't realize a jab was being thrown...

I've erased my 2 cents and will not post further.......

 

[Old Hunter]

Yep - free market economics - supply and demand. When demand exceeds supply, prices must rise. Not every tag in every state is over subscribed, mostly we are talking about the trophy units where people can't get tags.

A lot of people, myself included, would be happy to just get to go hunting every year. Throw in a trophy hunt every now and then when i can afford it, but to me its just as good to get out there. Now if the odds of filling my tag are something like 18% and there's 400 other hunters in my unit, then I don't think its fair for me to pay out the nose for that privilege.

And I don't want to sound elitist, but at 69 if you can still get around the mountains and pack out a deer, there are a lot of seasonal jobs you could do during the spring/summer to get enough money to be able to at least drive to a different unit. Not trying to be a jerk, I've just found if you want something bad enough, you will find a way to make it happen.

Do you understand what retired means? I worked my ass off for 45 years to take it easy in my later years and enjoy hunting and fly fishing. Which btw is what I do in the summer.

Maybe you don't want to sound like a jerk, but........

 

[xtreme]

I am trapped again Old Hunter. I only have one acre so no land owner tag for me. I am only 25 feet from the national forest and have to cross the Conejos to get to my house, all that is good. I have seen bear in my yard, several. We had a gaint of a bear three years ago and a giant mule deer. They were seen for three years and now they are both gone. Lack of a tag kept me from trying to shoot either one. I am not bitter about it. Either animal would have been the trophy of a life time. Btw, I still work pretty hard as I have a small herd of registered Beefmaster cattle to take care of.
I hope to make it to Dipping Lakes this summer, thats one of my goals, won't need a tag to do that, just camera.

 

[buckbull]

Fish are Game departments have budgets they have to deal with. Much of their budget comes from Non-Resident license fees. Based on the article mentioned earlier, Montana's fish and game department is ran with 2/3 of their budget coming from Non-Residents and I would guess other states like Idaho, Wyoming and Colorado are simliar. When these game departments have needed increased funds they always stick it to the Non-Residents. Its quite obvious why. The demand is still higher than supply for these tags so there is little fear that they will not have a measurable net gain in revenue. Also, non-residents can't vote for state legislature. Can you imagine someone within the fish & game department or even within the state legislature proposing fee increases for residents. Political suicide. So, if residents want more say in what goes on they probably need to kick in a little more jack. Twenty or thirty dollars for a deer tag in my opinion is ludicrous when you compare the amount of entertainment and potential protein that tag can buy. I can't take my family of 5 to the movies for under $60 just for tickets and would spend $20 in gas to go get there and back. We have the same horse $hit going on here in Illinois. Deer permit is $20 but nonresident tags are like $500. Then all the residents raise hell when the conservation department wants to increase fees, so the conservation department raises non resident fees and increases number of tags to make up for budget shortfall. Now all the residents complain about not having places to hunt anymore because of all the leasing going on to outfitters who cater to the non-residents.

 

[Old Hunter]

Supply and demand. We've got the elk. You don't!

 

[buckbull]

Yeah, and Money talks and BS walk

Nobody wants to pay more than they have too. Your right Old Hunter, you have the Elk so non-residents are going to have to pay the price to hunt them. Even though the fees are high, they could be a helluva lot higher than what they currently are. Guys still have to wait 5, 10, somtimes 20 years for premier Elk units so no doubt the ceiling hasn't been hit for non-residents. Sheep tag in Wyoming is over $2000 for a non-resident and there's a chance a guy could never draw the tag. I have in the past paid the "special" fee in Wyoming to just draw a tag in a reasonable amount of time. Fish and Game departments are walking a tight rope between residents and non-residents trying to keep both sides content all the while having to deal with tightening budgets. Just need to be thankful we all have an opportunity to hunt at all; even if it means we need to pay more out of pocket.

 

[Old Hunter]

That's why i'm glad my dad taught me to not be a trophy hunter. Nothing wrong with it if that's what you like. I enjoy the hunt and the meat. I pay no attention to the best units, and wouldn't wait to hunt them. Makes life easy.

Funny though. I've shot what some might consider a trophy. Even a blind squirrel finds a nut now and then.