Co Draw Odds...

[JimP]

I doubt that they will go back, they will make a lot of revenue off of just the application fees.

But I can see them requiring the applicant to purchase a "hunting" license such as Arizona or even Utah does in order to apply for the tags plus a increase in preference point fees if they don't require a license. I know a few non residents who are now purchasing a non resident fishing license for $56 which saves them money if they are putting in for 2 or more tags.

 

[Dos Perros]

They should have been doing that the whole time then. Instead of getting guys to apply for 15-20 years then quadruple the draw odds by changing the rules. Your views will be different depending which side of the fence you?re on.

I?m much more of an idealist than you would have guessed.

Excluding people when it?s their game just as much as anyone?s is immoral.

 

[Dos Perros]

If a guy can afford the tag when he gets drawn, he can afford to front it. The only thing it does is discourage guys from applying in several states and states with huge costs like NM.

Colorado allows a points only option. Makes no sense at all to require money up front for that. A guy shouldn?t have to be able to afford a hunt for every year between now and the time he actually draws.

 

[dirtclod Az.]

I agree with JIMP hunters should purchase a "hunting"license before applying for tags.Its the way its done here in Az.it only makes sense to have a licence before a tag is issued.

 

[CoHiCntry]

I?m much more of an idealist than you would have guessed.

Excluding people when it?s their game just as much as anyone?s is immoral.

So how cheap do application fees and or hunting licenses have to be so we aren't "excluding" anyone? Maybe they should just be free otherwise someone might be "excluded"? It's a slippery slope. I personally don't think anyone was excluded before.

 

[Colorado Cowboy]

I agree with JIMP hunters should purchase a "hunting"license before applying for tags.Its the way its done here in Az.it only makes sense to have a licence before a tag is issued.

Sorry I don't agree. Making an applicant for a big game tag purchase a hunting license is almost like stealing IMHO. If you don't get drawn, you have a hunting license that potentially will never get used, that's $$$ down the crapper. What's wrong with purchasing the license AFTER you get drawn, before you hunt? Lots of other states that require both tags and license do it this way. IMHO Az is just stealing my $$$ if I don't get an elk or deer tag.

 

[dirtclod Az.]

I hunt multiple times during the year.Quail,Rabbits,Javelina,most people will hunt more than just 1 Deer if they purchase a hunting licence,Get out and bring your children along. Purchasing a licence should be an opportunity not a burden.

 

[JimP]

You can bet that if a state requires me to purchase a hunting license for the draw that I am going to do more than just put in for the draw.

I hunt javelina and quail down in Arizona while I am building points for another animal. The javelina tags are farily easy to draw and it is a fun hunt. Forget a lot on how they hunt them in Texas over bait stations and get out and do some spot and stalking or get the binos out and start glassing. They are one of the funnest animals to hunt in my mind and the early spring hunts is a great time to get away from the snows and cold in Colorado. The meat is also great no matter what you have heard.

 

[Bonecollector]

I hunt multiple times during the year.Quail,Rabbits,Javelina,most people will hunt more than just 1 Deer if they purchase a hunting licence,Get out and bring your children along. Purchasing a licence should be an opportunity not a burden.

If I lived within a few hours yes, but from 2,000 miles away it is not. This philosophy is only valid for residents and folks who can readily hunt the state.

 

[QuazyQuinton]

Do I recall correctly that I read that Colorado is going to raise the app fee to $20 next year? I can't decide if I'm in favor or opposed, but that may shake things up a little again.

QQ

 

[Big Chief J]

I'm not opposed to paying more if that's what it takes, but just raise the application fees instead of making me buy a hunting license that I won't use if not drawn. Of course the money for increased application fees or buying a potentially useless license still comes out of my pocket so what does it matter...

 

[dirtclod Az.]

JimP hope to see you back in Az.again this year with your HAM tag.Hopefully we both have a little better luck this time around!dirtclod Az.

 

[JimP]

I'll be back or I'll be dead. You can't break a 25 year string of hunting down there.

On the luck side, I'll take it. I had 3 good chances last year and I myself blew it. They only one to blame was me. But I have figured that over that 25 years there has only been 5 or 6 years where I haven't brought one home. I also figure that if I never shoot another one I will be fine. I just enjoy getting down there and having fun.

I just wished that those dang quail were not as skiddish as they are by the time we get there in February. They will hold until you step on them or flush when you are 100 yards away, no in between.

 

[jimss]

The license and application fee issue is a crock if you ask me! I bet now that the CPW has gotten every tom, dick, harry, and their kids, and wives to apply they will up the fees or charge for a license to apply. I'm pretty sure Colo is thinking that it will give more new hunters the opportunity to hunt Colo? Once they get new people started on pref pts it will be tougher for them to quit once they have a few pts and years invested even if they increase charges to apply. In Wyo just the opposite has happened for nonres. Pref pt fees have sky rocketed and many guys are likely slowly but surely dropping out as they draw tags! It will likely backfire on Wyo. The WG&F was just as crazy because they will likely loose $ as more and more applicants drop out! Colo and Wyo are currently the extremes for application/license fees. If you ask me, both states are pretty darn ignorant!

 

[Dos Perros]

So how cheap do application fees and or hunting licenses have to be so we aren't "excluding" anyone? Maybe they should just be free otherwise someone might be "excluded"? It's a slippery slope. I personally don't think anyone was excluded before.

The median household income where I live is something like $53k. After taxes, student loans, rent/mortgage, day care, groceries, etc, I can?t imagine how someone who makes the median can even consider applying. These folks likely aren?t saving for retirement, likely have less than $3000 in savings. The point being, people have been excluded, the data bears that out and is irrefutable in my opinion.

 

[Bonecollector]

I agree many are excluded on Goat, Moose, Sheet.
However, I set aside $20 per pay (sometimes more) and it covers my tag. I even put all my loose change into a jar and "cash-in" for a few dollars. I shop with my cabelas card to earn points to buy my freeze dried goods, and usually split fuel with a travel companion. I stop and sleep in the vehicle to/from the hunting destination. Figure if I can rough it in a tent for a week, I'd better be able to sleep a few hours reclining in a comfy seat out of the elements.
It can be done, but I agree, it can be a challenge for some. Perhaps a trip every other year would be doable for said folks. I know a lot of hunters who can only afford to go west every 2 years.
Personally, I love it too much to not find a way every year. Even if all I have in my pocket is a couple $34 antelope doe tags.

 

[Slugz]

Well after the dust has settled from the goat/ sheep I think its fairly reasonable to say.....

If you are a high point guy who has been saving then you are ok.....you are still at the top and from you and above wont change. Where that line is at I don't know but I would say at 1.

If you are a 1 or no points guy......the 0-2 point hunt you used to go on every year will be tougher....how much I don't know.

I think if your a middle point holder it would be the same as the high point guys.....I mean no one can get above you right ?

I think point creep will first crush the 4 pt and under hunts......past that I don't know.

From a business standpoint of eliminating the bulk of the credit card fees for purchase/refund.....its makes numbers sense. Just wish we could have done it a different way.

 

[JimP]

Well after the dust has settled from the goat/ sheep I think its fairly reasonable to say.....

If you are a high point guy who has been saving then you are ok.....you are still at the top and from you and above wont change. Where that line is at I don't know but I would say at 1.

If you are a 1 or no points guy......the 0-2 point hunt you used to go on every year will be tougher....how much I don't know.

I think if your a middle point holder it would be the same as the high point guys.....I mean no one can get above you right ?

I think point creep will first crush the 4 pt and under hunts......past that I don't know.

From a business standpoint of eliminating the bulk of the credit card fees for purchase/refund.....its makes numbers sense. Just wish we could have done it a different way.

I actually think that if you have any points you will be OK in the future draw but if you went into this last set of draws with 0 then you might have a long time to wait.

I also don't think that it will affect those 2-4 point hunts until you draw it and then it will go up to 5-10 but who knows for sure.

On the refunds I believe that is why the CP&W would send out checks instead of just refunding it on your CC even if you applied using a card.

I'm just glad that except for antelope I am done chasing points mostly here in Colorado, but I am afraid that my 1 pt muzzle loader hunt might be long gone after this year. That along with my second choice muzzle loader hunt that I fall back on if I don't draw my #1 hunt.

 

[Colorado Cowboy]

I think the Non Resident is really the one who gets hurt. Sheep, goat & moose are going to be problems for both NR & residents. I don't think there will be much change for elk, deer, antelope & bear for residents. The tags that cost more than $100.00 are going to get hit. Just my take.......

 

[ColoradoV]

Another point is that with no res/non res quota for 2nd choice or leftover tags - they will be drawn out at basically the % of applicants...

Or fair and very accurate to say - residents that usually hunt on a 2nd choice - got the royal screw as chances to draw either a 2nd choice or get a leftover will go to 0 - 20% or close to that.. As the non res dont draw they will put in for 2nd choice tags that are all drawn equal % basis.

It might take a year or 2 but yea there will not be too many if any 2nd choice/leftover tagsafter the class of 18' and the folks used to getting these 2nds tags will not - then they will end up overcrowding the otc units for elk even more..

If you do email the cpw I would also point out how unfair the colorado system is for its resident hunters. CPW needs to look at a straight 80%-20% split in every area of all deer/elk licenses as well as 2nds and leftovers...