Wyoming needs to change..

SprintNShoot7

New Member
Dec 19, 2011
37
0
Wyoming
I can't comment on the NR tag situation as I am a resident, but I agree with liking to be able to go out with a rifle after the bow season, and I agree with Justin that something needs to be done about the mule deer, because it would be nice to have deer to hunt in the future. I would be bummed not hunting deer every year, but I would also like there to be a higher quality hunt for the deer.
 

In God We Trust

Very Active Member
Mar 10, 2011
805
0
Colorado
As hunters we can't have it all. Drawing great tags every year, tags for multiple methods of take, big bucks, and lots of resident tags. Getting all of that adds up to crowded woods with small bucks and declining herd numbers. More people hunting is not a bad thing, it means the sport will survive. Along with that it means we may have to wait a few years for a great tag to hang on a big animal.
 

justinthedoc

Member
Jul 15, 2011
75
0
No offense but i am tired of hearing "we need more hunters so the sport survives". Have you actually checked to see how many people aplly for licenses. Its overwhelming, they say less people are hunting back east, but thats not for lack of folks wanting to, its lack of a place to go. If you,the G&F, and I truly knew how many animals are being wasted by folks who dont know how to shoot a bow, but go, just so they can hunt more, and it looks cool on TV, there would be a choose your weapon, and 90% of those hunters would not appply for the archery tag. If you dont believe me go sit at a archery shop 5 days before the opener of elk season and watch the pure lack of morals and ethics. ( i need a bow setup going hunting tomorrow type crap).. We need to put the whole I can hunt longer attitude aside and truly take care of these animals. If we or I think its bad now just wait a few more years, I now several ranchers in good units that have access through the G&F or just give permission that are on the verge of shutn em down and going with a outfitter because of JOE PUBLIC. Also the WY G&F make 60% of there money on just fishing licenses alone, they dont need the NR money, they just cater to them for the tourism. ( I used to work for em) Like I said this is just a frustration post, there is no silver bullet, but I think its strange that all of a sudden we have boat inspections( 3mnths out of 12), stricter rules in state land and Parks, a freakn stupid decal on a boat for Invasive species (what a joke), but nothing has been done to better the quality of the hunt. Which is why we are all on this forum...

Sorry if i come off abrasive, I just truly love this state, but absolutely hate whats happening to it...
 
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Ultramagg

New Member
Jul 11, 2012
14
0
Cody, WY
I am new to this great state of Wyoming as of this last spring. So any tags that I applied for was as a non-resident. It has been very interesting to see both the resident, and non-resident sides of issues. More states are starting to discover that the non resident hunting season and tags is a huge money maker. Another non resident benefit is the tag drawing here actually seems early to us. Many of the surrounding states have not even begun to apply for the rifle deer tags. So June feels early to most. But Wyoming is one of the best states in the country for its wildlife and habitat and the country knows it. Be proud of your state because your way ahead of most. I am originally from South Dakota and could take a lesson from its neighbor Wyoming. IN GOD WE TRUST made a great point.
Many states over sell many counties tags and the hunt becomes a bad experience and the state gets bad reviews back....but again its just too good of revenue but in some areas, South Dakota wildlife is in BIG trouble, particularly its elk. Hats off to Wyoming for balancing everything better than most state. Its good to be here.
 

Ikeepitcold

Administrator
Staff member
Feb 22, 2011
10,028
1,615
Reno Nv
Here's my bitch. When I was 100% draw odds for Antalope this year why I didn't draw is beyond me. So why would they say it's 100% if it is not? I can't wait to hunt Wy and think the state is a great hunting destination.
 

Colorado Cowboy

Super Moderator
Jun 8, 2011
8,345
4,736
83
Dolores, Colorado
I not exactly sure how Wyoming calculates the drawing odds. Here in Colorado they publish drawing odds and they seem to round off the numbers eg. If there are 100 tags and 107 people apply, they saw the odd are 100% DRAW. If you look at the Wyoming stats that are online, I think you will see something very similiar.
 

bigsky2

Member
Mar 9, 2011
103
2
Wyoming does NOT need a preference point system for residents, it needs a BONUS point system for residents. I was a nonresident and thought Wyoming's drawing system was great because of the favorable draw odds and then moved here about a year ago and found out how much it sucks for residents. Someone should not have to go four or more years without drawing a bull or buck tag. A preference point system is not the answer because of point creep, knowing that you would have to have a certain amount of points before you have a chance to draw. In a bonus point system, everyone has a chance to draw, it's just that the people that have went the longest without drawing have the best chance to get the tags. Every year that you don't draw you get a bonus point, and your number of bonus points determines how many chances you have in the drawing. Montana uses this system for its residents in the limited quota areas.

I like that Wyoming has all the limited quota areas because it generally means a better chance at a mature animal when you do draw a tag. Wyoming probably has the best combination of quality and opportunity of all the western states, it's just that the opportunity should be a lot better for residents.

A huge problem I have with Wyoming is that they seem to put money as a higher priority than managing the big game herds. The mule deer population is clearly hurting and they refuse to cut back on tags. The numbers of antelope tags they give out for some units is ridiculous.

Another example of them trying to get as much money as possible is those invasive species stickers. I'm not against the idea of it at all, invasive species are a huge problem in some states and it's a good idea to be proactive about it, but they don't even inspect your boat before you can buy the sticker. I realize there's check stations at some lakes, but if you went to a lake that didn't have a check station there's nothing stopping someone from putting a boat in the water that was covered in zebra mussels.

Enough of my complaining, but WY definately needs to change the drawing for residents and I think a bonus point system would be the best way.
 

justinthedoc

Member
Jul 15, 2011
75
0
A bonus point, and a preferance point for elk, deer, and antelope would be the same thing. They give enough tags they would be Identical. For example area 120 elk 78 tags roughly 350 people applied. (Dnt know exact #) would be a 4.5% chance, a point system you would be guaranteed to draw that tag in 4-5 years or you could statistically speaking never draw the tag. Seems clear to me. If not how about area 7 roughly a 30-40% chance of drawing. Or a point system you would be guaranteed to draw in two-three years. I know people who havent drawn that area for 11 years. I agree a bonus point like CO has for sheep, moose and goat would definatly be the way to go, newbies will probably never draw a moose, and very slim on a sheep. To me it just doenst make sense to not want a point/bonus system, unless you sweet talked the "Unbiased" computer draw system of the G&F.
 
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HuntWYODon

Very Active Member
Dec 19, 2011
806
0
Kalifornia
No offense but i am tired of hearing "we need more hunters so the sport survives". Have you actually checked to see how many people aplly for licenses. Its overwhelming, they say less people are hunting back east, but thats not for lack of folks wanting to, its lack of a place to go. If you,the G&F, and I truly knew how many animals are being wasted by folks who dont know how to shoot a bow, but go, just so they can hunt more, and it looks cool on TV, there would be a choose your weapon, and 90% of those hunters would not appply for the archery tag. If you dont believe me go sit at a archery shop 5 days before the opener of elk season and watch the pure lack of morals and ethics. ( i need a bow setup going hunting tomorrow type crap).. We need to put the whole I can hunt longer attitude aside and truly take care of these animals. If we or I think its bad now just wait a few more years, I now several ranchers in good units that have access through the G&F or just give permission that are on the verge of shutn em down and going with a outfitter because of JOE PUBLIC. Also the WY G&F make 60% of there money on just fishing licenses alone, they dont need the NR money, they just cater to them for the tourism. ( I used to work for em) Like I said this is just a frustration post, there is no silver bullet, but I think its strange that all of a sudden we have boat inspections( 3mnths out of 12), stricter rules in state land and Parks, a freakn stupid decal on a boat for Invasive species (what a joke), but nothing has been done to better the quality of the hunt. Which is why we are all on this forum...

Sorry if i come off abrasive, I just truly love this state, but absolutely hate whats happening to it...
I agree with you except for one thing, look at the cost of non res. tags. 10 times the amount of a resident tag. I can't believe they don't need the money. All states are the same as for as non res. tags/lic. go. Az., Ut. and Co.. No different. What I don't agree with in Wy. is non resident's can't hunt in the wilderness areas with out a guide or resident. It's Federal (public) land not State land. I know it's for the Outfitter's benifit and so on but seriously ? Still my favorite place to hunt.
 
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justinthedoc

Member
Jul 15, 2011
75
0
I agree 100% about the wilderness part, guess they think its to wild for city-folk:). But the same claim can be said about Alaska, why can I go hunt black bear, but not grizz/coastals. Why can I hunt moose, but not sheep with out a guide. Arizona NR tag system is a scam if ya ask me I dnt know how many thousands I have given them just to put in for a desert sheep tag. As far as the more money thing goes I think it honestly sways some people from putting in and ya have a bettewr shot at getting a tag I guess, pretty soon we are all going to get screwd. no matter what state ya live in.
 

HuntWYODon

Very Active Member
Dec 19, 2011
806
0
Kalifornia
I agree 100% about the wilderness part, guess they think its to wild for city-folk:). But the same claim can be said about Alaska, why can I go hunt black bear, but not grizz/coastals. Why can I hunt moose, but not sheep with out a guide. Arizona NR tag system is a scam if ya ask me I dnt know how many thousands I have given them just to put in for a desert sheep tag. As far as the more money thing goes I think it honestly sways some people from putting in and ya have a bettewr shot at getting a tag I guess, pretty soon we are all going to get screwd. no matter what state ya live in.
Your are right. I forgot about Alaska. I think a non res. can only hunt moose, caribou, black bear and sitka blactails without guide. I totally agree about Az. too ! I'm "trying" to burn my 13 pts. for antelope and 10 for deer so I won't ever have to do it again. They make you buy a $151.00 lic. just to buy a pt. ( NV. also) I had loyalty pts. for deer, elk, antelope and sheep. I screwed up a few yrs. ago and put both my antelope and elk tag in the same envelope , Got rejected for both. Lost both loyalty pts. ! I called up and raised heck saying why take the loyalty pts. instead of just not drawing or losing that year's point ? I still paid for the lic.every yr. since 1987 ! What's the difference? The lady in lic. dept agreed with me but... I didn't know they were envelope challanged. I lost deer and bighorn loyalty pt. because I wrote a check that was 50 cents short like a dummy. I sent in during their correction time and never received a call. I made another phone call. The only thing I'm going to keep putting in for after I draw deer and antelope is archery elk and deer. I hunt with friends there for elk and deer a lot. But not going to play their game much longer.
 

justinthedoc

Member
Jul 15, 2011
75
0
If Alaska wasnt that way I would be up there every year hunting. Starting with Browns, mtn goats, dalls, buffalo. Would be hella fun, to bad I aint made of money. I would love to suit me some Game and Fish agencies for discrimination.Do you know how much money that would save one guy. I meand seriously 20 f-ing grand to hunt browns now is freaking re-donkulous. I agree that residents should have more tags for there home state but stuff like the wilderness in wy, and the stuff previously mentioned is B.S. really. Heres a interesting fact, my brother is a outfitter in CO, and WY. Resides in CO, wants to hunt moose, and sheep here has the points and the area hes apllying for is in a wilderness area. He cant hunt it without a giude or outfitter, but he can outfit himself and outher hunters there. What kind of sht is that WY. Stupid f-ng politics
 

HuntWYODon

Very Active Member
Dec 19, 2011
806
0
Kalifornia
If Alaska wasnt that way I would be up there every year hunting. Starting with Browns, mtn goats, dalls, buffalo. Would be hella fun, to bad I aint made of money. I would love to suit me some Game and Fish agencies for discrimination.Do you know how much money that would save one guy. I meand seriously 20 f-ing grand to hunt browns now is freaking re-donkulous. I agree that residents should have more tags for there home state but stuff like the wilderness in wy, and the stuff previously mentioned is B.S. really. Heres a interesting fact, my brother is a outfitter in CO, and WY. Resides in CO, wants to hunt moose, and sheep here has the points and the area hes apllying for is in a wilderness area. He cant hunt it without a giude or outfitter, but he can outfit himself and outher hunters there. What kind of sht is that WY. Stupid f-ng politics
The situation with you brother is re-donkulous ! I can't talk about this subject much with out getting pizzed off. Like you said, the cost of out of state tags is BS. You can't afford to take your kids anymore let alone yourself. They have made it a rich man's sport. Average Joe's like us take it in the pocket .
 

crumy

Member
Jun 19, 2011
122
0
Laramie, WY
To many general deer tagsi went out last year and saw very few shooters. Passed on some small bucks. Glad g/f is putting 3 pint min ondeer in the snowys. Supposed to be draw next year. Would also like to see preference point system on elk and deer.
 

trkytrack2

Active Member
Sep 13, 2011
270
0
Sterling, Colorado
But if you put in for the moose, goat, sheep, which should be a january only application period, draw could be done first of march to alllow thm their interest, aplly march thru april for elk, antelope, and deer and draw may. Seems simple to me and two months before the current tentative draw.

I am totally for a preference system for residents I have drawn 3 antelope, and like 9 elk. Where as friends of mine have drawn lik 15 antelope tags and 2 or 0 elk. Its hard to tell me that there draw system is completely unbiased

Plus this state has a serious mule deer problem and they choose to do nothing about it. (not enough time to type my true feeling on that issue)...
You'd like a preference point system for residents? Maybe they could set it up like Colorado's? My friend drew a tag for elk in Unit 2 here in Colorado. It only took 17 PP's to get drawn....17 years of applying! And that was for archery. For a rifle tag, my 13 year old boys would be in their late 30's before they would even be in contention for drawing a tag.
Don't wish to hard...you might just get the shaft.
 

HuskyMusky

Veteran member
Nov 29, 2011
1,337
183
IL
Many things can be improved...

I agree I'd like to see all apps due say feb1st, march1st, and a month later find out the results, and within 2 weeks have my refund, if not sooner! no reason a state needs to hang onto my money for more than 1 or 1.5months IMO!

non-resident elk tags should be season specific, ie... archery, rifle, muzzy... a guy from IL probably isn't going to make 2 or more trips for elk, 1 trip only... this would make draw odds higher IMO, and allow for more tags to be issued.
 

HuskyMusky

Veteran member
Nov 29, 2011
1,337
183
IL
Instead of a resident preference point system, I'd like the 'special' license option that the non-residents have.
what's a res elk tag cost?

part of the reason it works for non-res is that the difference between 500 and 1000 tag is significat!

if a res elk tag is say 60 bucks and a special means it would be 120, jsut about everyone would be willing to pay that... so not much of a help...

how about if they made the "resident special" price the cost of a standard non-res tag or a special non res elk tag...

doubt any res would be willing to pay 500/1000 for an elk tag in WY!

it would be interesting to try just put a couple res tags in a res-special at the non-res special price... and see if what the results are after 1 year...
 

Elkoholic307

Banned
Feb 25, 2011
1,217
1
Base of the Bighorns
if a res elk tag is say 60 bucks and a special means it would be 120, jsut about everyone would be willing to pay that... so not much of a help...
I still think it would help. Where I'm from, a lot of guys can barely afford to apply for elk, deer and antelope. If there was a resident special option it would seperate the weekend warriors from the serious hunters. I would gladly pay twice as much for better odds, but know tons of people that wouldn't even consider it.
 

HuskyMusky

Veteran member
Nov 29, 2011
1,337
183
IL
I still think it would help. Where I'm from, a lot of guys can barely afford to apply for elk, deer and antelope. If there was a resident special option it would seperate the weekend warriors from the serious hunters. I would gladly pay twice as much for better odds, but know tons of people that wouldn't even consider it.
I hear ya.

but when I hear this I think a res can't afford to apply for an elk, deer, antelope at in state fees!? if they only knew what non-res have to front... heck pts only for non-res in WY are $50, $40, and $30, moose is $75, that's $190 every year for just 1 pt for moose, elk, deer, antelope for a non-res in WY!

but sure I don't see why they couldn't have a special option for residents too, I say make the resident special the non-res regular price though!

I wish I could be the tag czar... lol.

I think states are starting to listen more to it's hunters and managing game better.