To all the elk hunters hunting in wolf country...

[packmule]

Lot of difference between 80lb and 180lb animals.

 

[tim]

the wolves did not come from alaska. I have heard that fairy tale, to many times.

I live in part of the state of idaho, that is always at the top or near the top for hunters killing wolfs. Last night, my wife made the comment, that elk are every where, she looks. And she is right. Granted still winter big time in the high country, so lots of elk down low. but there are alot of elk out there.

 

[AKaviator]

tim is right, the wolves were imported from Canada, not Alaska. (Insert joke about them ending their howl with "eh"!)

It's good that you have lots of elk around too, but wolves effect the elk. They may not decimate them while you have healthy populations of elk, deer, whatever, but they sure can keep them down, or worse, when trying to recover from a bad winter or die-off of some sort.

These wolves are apex predators and do a lot of killing all year long and it make all other species adapt to them. Up here, you'll find moose doing more calving in urban areas when they get overrun by predators in their traditional calving areas. That may be a reason that you see lots of elk around.

I happen to love seeing wolves and am glad they are here. I see lots of them. But they need to be actively managed if we are to have healthy populations of all wildlife.

 

[Colorado Cowboy]

tim is right, the wolves were imported from Canada, not Alaska. (Insert joke about them ending their howl with "eh"!)



These wolves are apex predators and do a lot of killing all year long and it make all other species adapt to them. But they need to be actively managed if we are to have healthy populations of all wildlife.

That my friend is a fact.

 

[tim]

good post akaviator

tim is right, the wolves were imported from Canada, not Alaska. (Insert joke about them ending their howl with "eh"!)

It's good that you have lots of elk around too, but wolves effect the elk. They may not decimate them while you have healthy populations of elk, deer, whatever, but they sure can keep them down, or worse, when trying to recover from a bad winter or die-off of some sort.

These wolves are apex predators and do a lot of killing all year long and it make all other species adapt to them. Up here, you'll find moose doing more calving in urban areas when they get overrun by predators in their traditional calving areas. That may be a reason that you see lots of elk around.

I happen to love seeing wolves and am glad they are here. I see lots of them. But they need to be actively managed if we are to have healthy populations of all wildlife.

 

[MTHusker]

There was a article in the Billings Gazette a few days ago regarding two wolves killing 5 ewes and 8 lambs on a ranch north of Gardiner. The rancher was given two permits to kill the wolves, but only if they are on his property.

 

[Longknife]

Another problem people don't realize is that it is very hard to manage a predator species. Ever try hunting one? Also they reproduce at a faster rate than their prey and while yes at some point things will balance out there will be a lot of damage inflicted. Here's a little news flash to the wolf lovers out there, we ARE an apex predator. In fact we are the #1 apex predator on the entire planet. We have enough hunters out there to manage wildlife populations without getting extra "help" from wolves. I'm a southerner from Louisiana and before you say what could I possibly know about this subject I will say I have read a great deal about the subject and can tell you first hand a scenario that I believe can be compared to the wolf problem. In just the last few years I've seen the turkey population and now beginning to see the deer population decline in one of the areas I hunt in southern Mississippi. Coyotes are the culprit here. We did not introduce them but they are here nonetheless. The damage inflicted on our turkey population is undeniable. The birds that are left are much more quiet also. Makes sense? I'm pretty sure an elk can put two and two together if a turkey can. I think the reintroduction of the wolf was a major screw up. They should be considered a predator and hunted year round just like we do with our worthless coyotes. If you feel I am being too hard, sorry that's how I feel. God made us stewards over wildlife. I don't believe in hunting to extinction but I believe where humans and wolves are competing for the same game animals we should not cater to the frickin' wolf and give them precedence or even protection.

 

[tttoadman]

I have been torn on this subject for years. I like the idea of having them, and I think some people want to manage elk and deer like a food crop. We have seen the positive impact when the elk heards are not allowed to lay around and eat the aspen all day. I am not educated enough on the subject to get into a debate, but it seems like the wolf population has quickly gotten away from the managers, and that was where it went to pieces. I do believe that opening year round hunting on them with no limits would take us right back where we started. There are enough people who want them "gone" to likely get the job done.

Those were my thoughts..............now I learn that these wolves aren't even from here to begin with?? WTF

Now I am more torn than before, but you can rest assured that I will be buying at least 1 wolf tag for idaho this year and try to help "manage" the population.

 

[Colorado Cowboy]

We (and I say we humans collectively) have depended upon our fish & game for survival for all time. We definately "manage" them today as a "crop". We limit the take, the size and the methods used in this "harvest". If we didn't it would be like the early 1900's when our fish and game here in the US was basically harvested almost out of existance. If it wasn't for the sporthunters and fisherman, we would not have what we have today.

The real problem with the wolf introduction into Yellowstone NP was that no sport hunting is allowed there and the game was allowed to overpopulate. A similiar situation is evident in Rocky Mt. NP. IMHO introducing a species that was not native to the area to control the game animals and classifying them as endangered, borders on criminal. It is surely not what Congress intended when they enacted the ESA. Pretty sad deal.What they should have done is put a 10" fence around the NP so the wolves could not get out and let them eat to their hearts content. Instead we all have to deal with them in our own way.

Sorry for my rant, but its not right and I have been and still am pretty ticked of about whats happened.

 

[mntnguide]

CC... you realize that a 10" fence wouldnt contain most squirrels...let alone wolves.. not sure if you meant a 10' fence which would have entailed it being basically its own ecosystem like a high fence operation. . Aside from that, the wolves were introduced at the same time as YNP, into most of Idaho and portions of Montana simultaneously. The whole scenario was ridiculous and unfortunately sponsored entirely by sportsman dollars, yet now that the Anti's love these things, its still OUR dollars that pay for them. Which is ridiculous.

As well, the wolves have not nearly taken off around YNP as they have in Idaho. Idaho is more or less one continuous mountain range which has enabled the wolves to spread and grow rapidly, where as Wyoming and Montana have more separated mountain ranges that have helped contain the spread of wolves. Wyoming has less than MT, and ID because of that reason especially. I guide right up to the line against Yellowstone in WY, so I am well aware the situation there, as I have also guided in the Frank Church Wilderness in Idaho. At least in WY, we still kill bulls of size, in Idaho we were lucky to even see elk sometimes. Its unfortunate for sure, and even though we now have seasons, the hunting will always be different and wolves will always be here. Idaho has a trapping program which is a great way to get at the high population during winter now that these wolves have become enlightened to hunters. They are a smart animal, and definitely will not be going away anytime soon. The hunting seasons, will never bring back the game that used to thrive before the wolves arrived.

 

[Colorado Cowboy]

Yes I meant 10 Feet, but my fingers just didn't get to the correct key....a common occurance for me! I did not know about putting wolves in the areas outside the park. You are right about how smart they are and that they are here to stay.

The thing that really scares me is that I believe that they will eventually be here in Colorado! There has already been 2 documented (but not highly publicized) cases of collared Yellowstone wolves found dead here in northern Colorado. They may not be a problem here in my lifetime, but it only a matter of time.

All done with our $$$ and the Endangered Species Act................

 

[MacDonald]

We have rapidly spreading packs here in North Central WA, but I haven't seen any differences yet in the deer & elk populations. It's still Winter in the high country though, and while Wenatchee's outskirts had a wolf a couple of weeks ago, nothing yet in Leavenworth area. The wolf was observed taking out an injured deer, and some idiot called the police, who "dispatched" the deer and hauled the carcass away so the wolf was forced to hunt again.

 

[MacDonald]

Wow!! First post here, and I'm a "junior member"! That's cool, to be a junior ANYTHING, at almost 65 years old Haven't been carded in so long I forgot what it's like!

 

[Timberstalker]

They affected my last elk hunt in Oregon's Silvies unit several years ago. We hunted the same area we usually do well in for several days with no luck, we couln't figure it out. We found elk before the season was over, but not where we usually hunt. The last nigh we heard wolves howling from camp and saw the tracks the next morning. It made sense then why were wern't seeing elk around camp. There are more in Oregon than they lead us to believe IMO. Without being able to use hounds for bear or cougar, now wolves, Oregon is in BIG trouble. Once the get into the Cascades, we will never control of them without poison.

Welcome to the forum MacD

 

[Eric Bailey]

Yes I meant 10 Feet, but my fingers just didn't get to the correct key....a common occurance for me! I did not know about putting wolves in the areas outside the park. You are right about how smart they are and that they are here to stay.

The thing that really scares me is that I believe that they will eventually be here in Colorado! There has already been 2 documented (but not highly publicized) cases of collared Yellowstone wolves found dead here in northern Colorado. They may not be a problem here in my lifetime, but it only a matter of time.

All done with our $$$ and the Endangered Species Act................

For me wolves are one of most powerful symbols of wilderness. Some of the first books I ever read as a kid were Jack London's White Fang and Call of the Wild. My dad likes to tell a story about me getting bullied at school and saying to him "and then I asked myself, what would White Fang do?" I guess I smashed the bully in the face with my lunchbox. I can't help but want to see them here in Colorado, but I'm sure not in any hurry given how they have torn up elk herds in ID and MT. I hope now that they are de-listed and eligible for state level wildlife management that Colorado can keep their numbers in check.

 

[mntnguide]

Wishing you had wolves in Colorado....You are about to get some major heckling about that statement..haha. Once the wolves push down that way, you wont only have a problem with massive amounts of hunters, you will start loosing the elk numbers that support it. . About a year ago a wolf that had been collared in Yellowstone was killed by a car in South Dakota...thats a lot of travel over both desert and mountains for one of them. Just goes to show that they can and will travel massive distances. Here is the article from a year ago... http://rapidcityjournal.com/news/wolf-found-near-pine-ridge-migrated-from-yellowstone/article_f6d01210-9f07-11e1-a76d-001a4bcf887a.html

 

[tim]

mtn guide is correct they where dropped into many areas at the same time. not just in yellowstone. the nez perce tribe was a big reason for the wolf transplanting into idaho. They wanted them. Personally we wouldn't be in the situation we are in if wyoming would have played with idaho and montana. Remeber the original charter was all 3 states had to have an approved wolf management plan. Idaho was first, montana second, and wyoming for whatever reason did not want to put one togehter. Therefore we as states where not allowed to manage the wolf. The wolf was allowed to do what they do and they have done it very well.

As far as hunting wolves, it is not easy, and the trappers seem to do a better job than the hunters.

 

[tttoadman]

I heard the collared wolf in Oregon was tracked clear over by medford or crater lake. that is a huge non-timbered area that she crossed to get there. They say she(I think) is wandering alone and has not found a mate. look out when she does.

 

[Colorado Cowboy]

For me wolves are one of most powerful symbols of wilderness. Some of the first books I ever read as a kid were Jack London's White Fang and Call of the Wild. My dad likes to tell a story about me getting bullied at school and saying to him "and then I asked myself, what would White Fang do?" I guess I smashed the bully in the face with my lunchbox. I can't help but want to see them here in Colorado, but I'm sure not in any hurry given how they have torn up elk herds in ID and MT. I hope now that they are de-listed and eligible for state level wildlife management that Colorado can keep their numbers in check.

I assume that you are a big game hunter because your here on this forum (altho not necessarily a given!). You had better hope they don't get a foothold here in Colorado. It is not only elk that will suffer population declines, deer will also be effected. In 2011 I was on a hunting trip to the Teton Wilderness (an area called Thorofare) near the SE corner of YNP. It is (or was) a pretty famous area for great elk and deer hunting. Notice I said was.... I hunted with an outfitter and in 6 hard days hunting only saw ONEdeer and 12 or 15 elk. Did see lots of bones and lots of wolves. Pretty sad siruation.

Colorado has some wonderful big game hunting that offers lots of opportunities for hunters (along with lots of money from the hunters). If you really want to see wolves, move to one of the areas where there are lots of them! If I ever see one here in Colorado its SSS time.

 

[groc426]

I hate to be this guy, but any place that have elk herds enough to sustain wolves will eventually be affected. It's all a matter of time. Way too many people sympathetic to the wolves to slow down their progression now.