@ archer8524
just bought thesepants yesterday after much thought. I own under armour derecho fleece (their wind/ waterproof fleece) and prefer apx to it. Alot thinner yet windproof. Love the "bib like" design to keep your lower back and kidneys warmer. Also love sidepocketsdesign. Overall very pleased, wish they would use more camopatterns for their gear. hope this helps. Let me know if any questions.