Knight Ultra-Lite *MAJOR MALFUNCTION*

[mallardsx2]

Well YIPPPEEE.... would be a shadow of what I have experienced so far.

-Hang Fires ( I honestly feel this is due to the STUPID new design of the breech plug on these ultra-lite muzzleloaders) Super long flash channel. I think the flash channel is filling up with powder and acting as a "Fuse" Its definitely not my powder and not my primers. Is anyone else experiencing these problems using granular powder?

THEN.......

-Went to fire the gun heard a small click and realized that the trigger had not went off completely upon squeezing it. Was like what the heck?!?! Stood up and jiggled the safety and the gun went off while sitting in the lead sled. Scared the living $hit out of me would be an understatement. Jumped clean out of the lead sled and landed on the bench. Now the safety wont come off and the gun wont fire at all.

Thankfully I had the thing pointed in a safe direction (Of course) or things could have turned out really badly.

I am afraid to touch anything with this kind of an issue. At this point the gun is simply unsafe to shoot. FACT.

I sent it back to knight overnighted at my cost...

I hope this was an isolated incident but is anyone else experiencing any of the same issues with their ultra-lite?

If I have said it one I have said it 1000 times. I CANT BUY ANYTHING THAT WORKS.

To top it all off I am going on an Elk hunt in Colorado with a tag I drew in with 5 points for and I am leaving on the 2nd of august.

I really hope they get this thing fixed and make it right with me with the shipping and everything since this is a 100% AMERICAN company.

 

[Colorado Cowboy]

Have you called them and explained your situation? Considering the problems you've had, might light a fire under their arse.

 

[ivorytip]

wow, keep us informed on how it plays out, that sucks!

 

[mallardsx2]

I called today and talked to them. They said as soon as they get the gun they will take care of it and get it back to me. Like I said 50000 guns could be made and I would end up with the bad one. Im not kidding. If you guys knew how many guns I have bought that have came from the factory defective you wouldn't believe me.

The only firearm manufacture that I have ever purchased from that has no issues is Browning but I suppose I shouldn't jinks myself.

 

[CoHiCntry]

Hey mallard, sorry your having trouble. I hope Knight gets it taken care of quickly. Unfortunately their customer service isn't that great. The ultra-Lite is a good gun though. I was out shooting mine today! When I first took mine out after I bought it, it wouldn't let go of the primer after shooting it. I had to use the palm of my hand like a dead blow to get the bolt to release the primer. That ended my first range session pretty quickly! I called Knight about it but as with other things in the past I got no call back. I found out through some research that the plugs in the new guns pretty well stink! The tolerances for each gun makes it a crap shoot on wether or not you will get too much blow back or not. That was my problem, to much blow back was actually expanding the primer (swelling) so it wouldn't come out of the primer pocket. Also the vent liner in the stock breech plug is only good for about 100 shots. After they get worn out accuracy becomes an issue. So instead of shimming the primer pocket on the stock breech plug to fix the blow back issue, I got an after market plug made by a guy on a muzzleloader forum. These plugs are supposed to never wear out. He also measures your guns tolerances and makes the breech plug just the right size so there's optimum crush on the primer. They are a little expensive but figured it was worth the investment. He sells a lot of breech plugs to guys on that forum and everyone has been really happy with them. If Knight does get your gun fixed to at least hunt with this year, you might look at one of these aftermarket breech plugs knowing the one in your gun will only last 100 shots or so.

Curious... what primer, bullet and powder combination are you using???


I know it's not ideal but if you can't get that gun shooting right before the season and your backs against the wall, I've got an extra muzzleloader you can use for the season. It's a CVA Optima... your not getting my Knight! Lol!

 

[mallardsx2]

I am shooting 120 Gr or BH 209 Powder and Federal 209A Primers 300Gr Thor Bullets .502 Diameter

I really appreciate the offer for me to use your gun! I will get it figured out. Or they will and I swear to god If I get that gun back and it hang fires on me one more time I am selling it. I am really sick about this whole ordeal. Spending 1000$ to have a gun that has tolerance issues is hogwash.


The guy from knight told me that I wasn't compressing the bullet tight enough to the powder and that what was causing the delay....Told me I needed to put a piece of cardboard in between the powder and the bullet. He said that it makes all the difference in the world. I told him he should tell them to re-design their breech plug for the ultra-light the same way they make the breech plug for the long range hunter. Cause that gun goes off every single time. This new breech plug design is poor. It has a hexagonal channel coming towards the primer from the powder side that is almost impossible to clean. I had to put mine in an ultrasonic cleaner. Drill bits don't clean everything out of there. The real underlying problem is that all of these new guns are designed to shoot pellets not loose powder with the structure of BH 209...

Even CVA recognizes the problem with getting BH 209 to ignite. Hence the reason they sell the separate breech plug specifically designed for it!

Morning rant over.

 

[ivorytip]

id be upset to man

 

[Umpqua Hunter]

I don't know if this helps but I have had no hang fire issues with my Knight DISC Extremes. They have a fairly deep hole in the breech plug which is about the size of a 22 long rifle case. It my rifle the breech plug hole holds about 4 grains of powder.

I saw a video a few years ago evaluating different primers. Apparently there have been problems using 209 primers when the percussion of the primer going off dislodges the load before fully igniting the load. Picture in your mind that the bullet has been pushed forward by the primer and the load is no longer "compressed" (for lack of a better word) and now the powder is trying to light in this uncompressed state. The video was pursing a "softer" primer, that threw enough flame for reliable ignition but had the softest pressure in order to not dislodge the load. This was measured in the video by putting a ramrod down the barrel with the barrel level, and firing a primer only (no powder or bullet). The distance the ram rod was pushed out was then measured and compared against other primers. Fiocchi primers were the softest that were tested. I have shot Fiocchis in my Knight Disc Extreme with BH209 and have never had a miss fire or hang fire. I have also seen some very accurate loads published on the internet using Fiocchi primers.

The other thing I would do is hold the breech plug up to a bright light and make sure the hole is totally clean. In my kit I have drills that closely fit all the "holes" and every time I clean the rifle I chase these holes (spin the drill with my fingers) to remove any powder residue or scale. It is particularly important that the finest hole is fully clear.

EDIT: Read through the thread, not sure this is gonna help you though.

 

[mallardsx2]

I'm definitely going to do the primer test. Good Call. I have no clue how a primer could possibly move that bullet I just literally jammed down the barrel (Its a little tight) but I will certainly try.

Will a fiocchi primer ignite BH 209 powder?

 

[CoHiCntry]

How much have you shot this rifle? Has it mis or hang fired from the beginning? I've not heard of anybody else having an issue like this with their ultra- lite, so I don't believe it's a real common problem. Do you use a drill bit to clean out your breech plug while at the range? I clean out my breech plug from the primer end every three shots with a drill bit. Just spin it by hand. Lots of crud comes out. If there's a ton of build up, that might cause some firing issues. I shoot almost the exact load you do... 110 gr. BH209, 250 gr. Thor bullet & a Winchester W209 primer.

BTW... the guy at Knight was correct that the Thor bullets like to be seated firmly on the powder. I make sure I seat them really well.

 

[Umpqua Hunter]

Will a fiocchi primer ignite BH 209 powder?

Never had a misfire with BH209 with Fiocchi primers. I've shot this combo in Knight DISC Extremes and my old CVA Accura.

 

[mallardsx2]

It has hang fired from the first shot with a brand new clean rifle and breech plug. I even switched my primers and powder to new ones thinking that maybe mine got moisture in them.

 

[mallardsx2]

As a followup to my issues with the gun:

I would like to compliment the Knight team on the quick repair and turn-around on getting me my gun back. I am heading to the range this evening to see how it preforms. They sent me a pack of bullets to try in the gun as well (At no cost to me)

Things that were done and covered 100% under warranty.

-Cracked Stock (No idea how this happened but I didn't even notice it they called me and told me about it??)
-Replaced breech plug with a style more applicable to Blackhorn 209 powder (I Insisted this and they obliged)
-New Timney Trigger with New safety (Their Idea, Not mine, but it is nice)

I wont lie..... I am a little sore about the whole situation but hopefully the range trip will put some confidence back into my head.

Colorado trip in....23 days

 

[CoHiCntry]

Did you get a chance to head to the range yet? How did it go? I saw your selling your muzzleloaders... unless there's someone else with the "mallardsx2" handle on the muzzleloader forums where I saw the classifieds post???

 

[mallardsx2]

I went to the range and sighted in the gun. Everything checked out fine. The gun went off like it was supposed to and it shot great.

I went home cleaned the ultra-lite and put them both of my knight rifles up for sale.

 

[gonhunting247]

I have an old MK-85 and a Ultra-Lite western extreme that I purchased last year and took to UT. I shot a nice 6 pt. with it. I have never had a problem with either of them, but it is a little confusing what setup to use, since they have 3 different breech plug, nipple, bolt combinations that make it legal in all the different states and allows for primers, caps, powder, pellets etc. It sucks you ended up with a crappy one. I had good luck with costumer service when asking questions, but it did take a couple different people to answer them. I know how you feel when you get soured on something, best to get rid of it and start over sometimes! Good luck in CO!

 

[mallardsx2]

Thank you sir.

The Long Range Hunter Sold Yesterday.

 

[Slugz]

I'm really surprised to hear all these issues (granted two different guns) with out of the box weapons. Bummer.

 

[mallardsx2]

Ruger-10/22 (Jammed ever single shot right out of the box bad receiver)
Charles Daly 12 Ga semi (Locking bolt assembly 3 times returned to manufacturer)
Traditions Buckskinner Flintlock (Lock Broke)
Tarus Tracker 22 Revolver (Failure to index cylinder)
NEF 17 HMR (Trigger spring broke 3rd shot)
Walther P22 (Jammed every single shot right out of the box)
Knight Long Range Hunter (Spent 200$ in ammo trying to get it to group)
Knight Ultra-lite (You all know the story)
Ruger Mark II pisol (safety malfunction jammed every other shot)
2016 Ram 2500 Diesel (Made it 50 yards out of the parking lot and touch screen took a crap)
Kubota MX 5200 (In shop brand new 3 weeks)
Matthews Heli M -(String randomly came off cam while drawing bow trashed cam and string HUGE BATTLE TO FIX)
Matthews LX- (Limb broke)
Hobart Handler 140- (Welded for 15 minutes then stopped working)
Every single power drill I have ever bought - (Lasted 5 months maximum)
FOXPRO- (Every call I have had I had to return)
Vortex Binoculars- Optics were Crooked as a dogs hind leg out of the box (Luckily they have a great warranty)
Danner Boots (Elk Hunters)- Leaked like a seive from day 1
Summit Cobra XLS - Welds cracked from factory (Trashed it with a backhoe bucket I was so mad)
Humminbird Helix 10 SI- Problems with this right out of the box
Min Kota Rip tide SF mono arm- Burned up lower unit in 15 minutes

The list goes on and on and on and on but these are the big ticket items....lol

Dont even get me started on computers, fishing poles, and reels....

Honda and Browning. If it isn't one of those two brands I swear I should buy it.

On top of that Everywhere I go it rains. Think I'm joking?
Hang out with me for a week or so....100 people have called me out on it. My wife said its the most bizarre thing she has ever witnessed. lol She still loves me though.

I guess some people just have bad luck. I'm one of them. At this point in my life I just shrug my shoulders.

I accept disappointment from everything I buy and when it doesn't fail its surprises the hell out of me.

 

[JimP]

Sounds like you need to change your user name to "Joe Btfsplk" a character from the Lil'Abner cartoons.

He always walked around with a black cloud hanging over his head.