Elk Pref. Point Question/ Ideas

[bowrunner]

Hey guys.

My dad and I recently jumped into the Wyoming preference point game this past year, giving each of us 1 point for elk. I have hunted Colorado in the past, but never Wyoming. In Colorado, you can build preference points and still hunt every year with their OTC Archery tags. I know in Wyoming, the General Tag is a drawn tag, but you have decent odds of drawing it. Is there a way, like Colorado, where you can build up points and still draw a General Tag without using your points? I was looking up draw odds and I want to make sure I have this correct that unless you buy the more expensive "Special" tag, no one drew their second choice tags?

Also, if anyone has a recommendation as to a strategy for future hunts I would be interested. I am deciding between these two strategies... basically I am wondering if the difference in quality between a general Wyoming tag and a limited unit is worth the wait. (I like hunting a lot, not necessarily hitting the record books by the way)

We prefer bowhunting, but who knows, maybe a rifle hunt at some point.

1)Hunt Colorado each year until I build points for either a good Colorado unit or a good Wyoming unit. (While still applying to a good New Mexico unit)

2)Hunt Colorado each year and every 3 years or so hunt with a general Wyoming tag. (While still apply for New Mexico)

 

[Hilltop]

No chance at drawing the general in Wyoming as a second choice. You can get cow tags without using your preference points but not the general tag. As far as waiting for a LQ area its a personal choice. There is some very good general tag hunting but of course there is some better hunting if you build points for a premium area. I go back and forth with myself on this frequently. I did build 7 points once and took a great bull- but it wasn't fun waiting 8 years to hunt Wyoming elk. I'm sitting on 2 points now trying to decide what to do.

 

[LCH]

Used to be, you could put in for a difficult draw tag in the special, and draw a general as your 2nd choice, retaining your points. There are enough people putting in for that general tag now, though, that that option has gone away.

You can always build points and draw Type 6 cow tags, or buy leftover Type 4 cow tags, to spend time in elk country until you get the Type 1 tag you want.

If you are OK with hunting general and spending the dough, you could probably draw that tag just about every year in the special as a 1st choice and forget about elk points.

Then there's the idea you mentioned, find a spot somewhere like CO, ID, or MT that you can hunt every year, and just hunt Wyoming when you draw. Depending on the quality of your hunts in your annual area, you may decide you can wait on a LQ area or you may want to spring for the general tag.

 

[bowrunner]

It sounds like this is a common predicament. I think the logical answer is to quit my job and move to Wyoming so I can have a better chance of drawing good tags... but that might not go over well.

So maybe for this year I will try my 1/300 chance at the random draw for a LQ area and build another preference point, and most likely hunt Colorado again. Then I will really need to make a decision over the next year and research hunting areas. If I decide to wait it out for a LQ area, I think I will try to draw a cow tag in the few years prior to hunting for a bull. I can learn the area that way.... Also, perhaps my dad and I can alternate years with a tag to maximize the exposure to an area.

Would you say, from any experience that you have, that a general tag unit in Wyoming is better than a OTC unit in Colorado?

 

[Hilltop]

I think so but I grew up in Wyoming so I know a few areas really well. IMO area knowledge is a huge key to being successful on most general tag hunts. I have friends that prefer Colorado- but they go every year so they know the area they hunt very well.

 

[bowrunner]

I agree with area knowledge. That all makes sense to me.

 

[LaHunter]

Another factor to consider is point creep. This is real. I applied for a LQ elk unit this past year with 5 points. In 2015 this was a slam dunk, 100% draw with 5 points. In the 2016 draw, 5 points only gave me about a 35% chance of drawing in the regular draw.
If your building points, just something to be aware of.

 

[bowrunner]

Another factor to consider is point creep. This is real. I applied for a LQ elk unit this past year with 5 points. In 2015 this was a slam dunk, 100% draw with 5 points. In the 2016 draw, 5 points only gave me about a 35% chance of drawing in the regular draw.
If your building points, just something to be aware of.

LaHunter, I think I am going to research some mid-level units also and see if instead of waiting for one of the big name units I can draw one of those a little more often. The point creep is something I definitely need to consider, so maybe the big name units that everyone wants is really out of the question at this point. Thanks

 

[Hilltop]

The PP game for elk isn't as bad as the moose situation. Someone new starting this year can still reasonably expect to be able to draw a solid tag in the next 10 years. You won't get area 100 but you can probably draw area 7 before your too old to hunt.

 

[bowrunner]

Ok, I appreciate the encouragement. I think I have some research to do. Maybe the way to go is to learn a unit rifle hunting for a cow. Then wait until I draw it to bowhunt for a bull. My dad has a 340 weatherby mag. that he wants to try out. lol.

Do you think the elk would be in a much lower elevation during the rifle season then they were during the September bow season?

 

[Slugz]

BR,

This is how we tackle it. Obviously I'm living here so a little easier, but if wanting to hunt every year it still could apply for a non res. This is Colorado specific and we make decisions based on wanting to bowhunt every year, have solid knowledge of an area and continue to scout/hunt to develop the next spot or secondary hunt area for the future. We are not huge horn hunters and just want to see and hear screaming in the woods each September.

We have a primary limited hunt archery GMU with average bulls and average bull to cow ratios that we apply for every year. This GMU was chosen as it also has muzzleloader, and rifle 1/2/3/4 seasons with both A and B tags and most years some on the leftover list post draw.

Years we don't draw the archery tag (A Either Sex) we hunt a fringe GMU that is OTC archery. Usually same herd, same weather patterns etc etc same altitude of the animals. We will then grab our second tag (leftover) and go rifle hunt our primary archery GMU. It really has helped to build the overall picture in the area of what's going on year after year while scout hunting other areas that are close.

Now obviously hard for a non res to do the two tags a year program for most guys (due to time off) but you can execute the fringe GMU hunting every year while building the points to draw the limited hunt.

Or as you said, just make the move west and simplify everything!

WRT the elevation question. They move due to pressure 1st then weather. In our primary hunt GMU our camp is at 10,500 and the elk are around camp and up to 11,000 ( highest alt around us) during archery. We usually push them down the mountain to 8-9k or 1.0 miles from camp from the archery opener to muzzleloader Sep 12. Once muzzleloader is over they are 2.0 - 2.5 miles from camp and at 8,000 until the end of archery Sept 26th. From the end of archery till the beginning of 1st rifle Oct 15th or so they move back up to the mountain and are at 10,000 due to no pressure. Once rifle season starts they scatter and are in the deepest darkest spots/secluded canyons hiding from pressure ( but with feed and water close).

Usually the snow needs to be touching their bellys (just hard to scratch up grass)before they start the bigger migrations to wintering grounds. So to answer your question they will be where unpressured and have feed and water to recover from the rut.

Now to simplify that. We archery hunt every year, build points and gather intel for future spots every year.

 

[bowrunner]

Slugz, that was extremely helpful. The fringe unit theory makes perfect sense. I have been slowly gaining intel over the past few years of a few Colorado units, and learning some movement patterns. One of the units is actually a fringe unit, and I like the area a lot. It is just a difficult hike up to where the elk are without horses, but my dad and I made it up there. We made the hike this past September, but when we got there we found some cowboys with dogs gathering up the last of their cattle. Im sure the elk were still there somewhere, but I think the coyboys pushed them around quite a bit. We backed out and went to another unit and learned a few things about that unit. I definitely had a great time this September in Colorado.

Gathering knowledge is definitely key. I am slowly starting to build some base knowledge about a few areas. I think building some knowledge in a few areas in another state would be fun, so maybe that what I need to start doing in Wyoming. Find a good general tag area and learn that unit like I am in Colorado.