So I'm looking at the Elk 2014 Draw odds and I have a question. I have 6 points now and 7 points going into 2015, is it possible for me to get a general tag as a 2nd choice rifle or archery and save my points? All help is appreciated. Thanks
Yep, more than a darn good chance as UH stated, as everyone has always drawn that tag as a second choice in the Special Draw, although the stats don't show it, and a couple years ago even some that had it as a third choice drew when the second choice pool was exhausted and there were still some tags left. It will not be drawn if you put in for the lower price regular draw. FYI if you draw that tag it is strictly for the rifle season in all the general units, but you can hunt with your bow then with no further permits needed. In order to hunt them with a bow outside those rifle season dates you would need to then buy a $30 archery permit for the early bow season dates in September. Wyoming does have a few units where there are tags strictly to hunt with a bow and they are designated as A/O (archery only) on the unit lists. Everyone, regardless of what season or what you hunt with, is required to purchase a $12.50 Conservation Stamp.
Last edited by Topgun 30-06; 06-25-2014 at 06:28 AM.
I have seen this mentioned a couple of times on different forums, but have never been able to find the statistics to back it up. What odds are you guys looking at to determine that you can draw it 2nd choice special?
From the drawing odds on the Wyoming Game and Fish website: in the special draw for the general tag this year 1088 people put in with 0 points as 1st choice, 697 people drew in the PP draw. This left 391 1st choice applicants for 386 tags in the random draw. So as I read the stats, 5 people who put in 1st choice special with 0 points didn't draw, and none of the 468 people who put in as 2nd choice special drew. I must be missing something, I apologize in advance for my ignorance!
So to look at the actual chance of drawing the tag Special 2nd choice one would have to find the number of minimum total elk tags the state requires to NRs, and subtract the total number of elk tags issued from this required number? (then compare the remaining number of tags to how many people applied 2nd choice special)
That is a very interesting "loop hole". Just out of curiosity, off the top of your head do you know if they publish information/numbers on this process anywhere? I looked through the WGFD regulations but didn't find anything.
Thanks, a lot! No one has ever laid out exactly how that works.
I found some information in this document: http://wgfd.wyo.gov/web2011/imgs/QRD...TIONS_CH44.pdf
on page 44-11.
It says: "...If the seven thousand two hundred-fifty (7,250) license quota is not issued in the initial
nonresident drawings, the Department may achieve the seven thousand two hundred-fifty (7,250) license
quota by issuing general elk licenses."
It doesn't explicitly say that they go to the NR special applicants, but it makes sense that they would to maximize revenue.
It's not really a loophole, but rather that most people just don't know why all those second choice applicants are getting tags when the list on the site shows what it does and would make them ask the exact question(s) you are! No, there is nothing on the website anywhere that speaks to what we're talking about. Sorry, but I can't remember the exact number of NR tags the statute requires to be issued each year. WapitiBob or someone else that knows may read this and be able to answer that question. Yes, you should be able to get that other draw information that I mentioned from the G&F Licensing Section, but it would be of no use and probably why they don't show that final pass to issue those tags because you would either know you were successful or not on your private account as soon as they post the draw results in February. That information, just like all the other draw odds, would vary from year to year and really isn't much use other than to know what I've stated is how those extra tags get issued. Looking at the draw odds is helpful, but you can't truly rely on them when you apply because you have no idea how many people will apply for a given tag in any one year with a certain number of PPs, especially with people that have banked PPs suddenly jumping into the draw process that you might not have figured on or changing their choices from year to year when they dont get drawn the preceeding year. Thus what is called point creep in the draw process that we are seeing more of as we're now into eight years of the NR PP method.
Thanks guys for the informative conversation on this topic. I appreciate it.